Bring back the gallows for this type of stuff. $143 million in fines is NOTHING, its literally encouraging this type of behavior. Utterly despicable.
Health-records software pushed opioids to doctors in secret deal with drugmaker
151–160 of 269 posts
Re: Health-records software pushed opioids to doctors in secret deal with drugmaker
#152“ The San Francisco-based company was founded in 2005 and became known for its unique model of providing free, ad-supported health-records software to independent doctors.” I thought we have some of the most expensive doctors in the world, why can’t we get paid ehr software? The ceo responsible for this mess is Tom Langan . Why we are not able to put him in jail for a year is still a mystery. This is pure evil.
Jail for a year??? How about the rest of his pathetic life, human beings with this level of depravity do not belong in our society, period.
Re: Health-records software pushed opioids to doctors in secret deal with drugmaker
#153Earlier quoted context omitted.
More than that. This is unethical design. It's a design that probably killed people.
I think it's safe to remove probably. This went down a chain of people. CEO. VP. PM. Tech Lead. Developer. All of them made a choice to kill people for profit.
Would this same logic apply to other jobs? For example, do people who brew beer make the choice to kill others? If the drunk drivers add a level of indirection that prevent blame, then why doesn't the same happen with the doctors in this case?
Gun manufacturers? People who build cars that have a known higher fatality rate? People who build swimming pools (look up how many kids die to swimming pools a year)? People who sell unhealthy food? People who make tech/video games that result in less physical activity?
Re: Health-records software pushed opioids to doctors in secret deal with drugmaker
#154I'll definitely put that on my list of arguments against proprietary software (although I'm aware that's not the primary issue).
Re: Health-records software pushed opioids to doctors in secret deal with drugmaker
#155Earlier quoted context omitted.
You could ask your provider to use Epic, which is none of those and can cost upwards of 10k a year per doctor. Practice fusion is an industry leader precisely because it makes delivering care compliant and cheap for doctors. In any case, the user of EMR's are providers, not patients.
Also, I've never heard a good thing about Epic...
That’s because their customer is the institution, not the provider. The experience of the end user is probably not even in their top 3 priorities (similar to other enterprise software like Atlassian).
Re: Health-records software pushed opioids to doctors in secret deal with drugmaker
#156Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I would do that job. I would take that money. I don't get a stupidly-inflated Valley salary with bonus RSUs, and I have bills to pay. I don't have a union that can protect me from nonsense. I know it's wrong. I would do it anyway, because I have been screwed by every company I have ever worked for, such that I learned that my ethics don't matter. Money matters. You've identified a perverse incentive that requires p…
The Uncle Ben Parker Contrapositive applies: with no power comes no responsibility. As long as "at will" employment exists, then no contract terms exist, and no labor law can stick to the employer, so long as they are willing to lie whenever there is no contradictory evidence. If the employee gets fired for asserting their rights in the law, and the employer can say it was an "at will" termination, the employee has n…
Thank you for putting it these terms. I do agree with your overall point. Perhaps I worded my view poorly. I am more in favor of software engineers having the same liability that engineers in other fields have. If a civil engineer signs off on plans for a bridge that gets people killed, liability will fall upon their employer and the engineer themselves. In that sense, there are incentives for both the employer and the engineer not to design structures that cause harm.
> If you aren't putting c-level executives and/or board members in prison, and forcibly restructuring or dissolving corporations, you aren't doing anything to protect me, the worker.
Agreed.
> I was about to be incredulous, but I actually do believe that you would rather have me fired and put in prison, and my dependents thrown in the gutter, than to have a software workers' union or stronger federal labor laws that might possibly protect me from an arbitrary dismissal if I tell my boss "What you are asking me to do is unethical." Thanks for that.
On the contrary, I am in favor of unionization and stronger labor laws in IT.
Re: Health-records software pushed opioids to doctors in secret deal with drugmaker
#157If I would know that my MD is using a free, cloud based, ad-supported platform to keep my health records I'd be rather ticked off...
The age old adage... If you're not paying for the product, you are the product...
And if you are paying for the product, you are usually the product, too. This adage is as useless as it is trite.
Re: Health-records software pushed opioids to doctors in secret deal with drugmaker
#158Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think it's safe to remove probably. This went down a chain of people. CEO. VP. PM. Tech Lead. Developer. All of them made a choice to kill people for profit.
Would this same logic apply to other jobs? For example, do people who brew beer make the choice to kill others? If the drunk drivers add a level of indirection that prevent blame, then why doesn't the same happen with the doctors in this case? Gun manufacturers? People who build cars that have a known higher fatality rate? People who build swimming pools (look up how many kids die to swimming pools a year)? People wh…
We all choose every day to continue reproducing business as usual.
Re: Health-records software pushed opioids to doctors in secret deal with drugmaker
#159Earlier quoted context omitted.
You could ask your provider to use Epic, which is none of those and can cost upwards of 10k a year per doctor. Practice fusion is an industry leader precisely because it makes delivering care compliant and cheap for doctors. In any case, the user of EMR's are providers, not patients.
I can't imagine what kind of reaction you'd get to asking a medical provider to use specific software. As a patient, you're not a doctor, it's not your wheelhouse, it really isn't your place to tell them how to fulfill their job function, even if that software isn't in your best interest -- because the latter point will be quickly lost to the former.
Changing EMR’s is an enormous amount of work and money, regardless of practice size. There isn’t even a standard way to transfer records between them, though I think the ACA created a phased plan to improve interoperability between systems.
When I worked in a small practice that had converted from paper to electronic records, we didn’t even bother scanning in all the legacy paper records. They just sat in the doctor’s basement at home until the required 7 years passed until they could be destroyed. I’m not sure what would happen if that same doctor had to switch EHRs. I would guess they’d just leave the records on the old system and keep paying for both.
Re: Health-records software pushed opioids to doctors in secret deal with drugmaker
#160As a non-American I'm also curious about the mass necessity of opioid painkillers to begin with. From what I hear, people are prescribed opioids post surgery etc. which is bonkers to me as a foreigner. I'm a middle aged person and I have never seen anyone using opioid painkillers anywhere in my life. They give stuff to you when you are having surgery, and when you are in hospital's care, but something very extraordin…
You're premise is likely incorrect. As a non-American there is a very good chance there is an opiate available over the counter with no prescription in the form of codine. https://www.oecd.org/health/health-systems/opioids.htm It's not an American problem, its a "First World" problem.
But usually in small amounts, in small containers at high prices. And mixed with far more toxic ingredients.
It doesn’t stop everyone. But for those it doesn’t, they risk succumbing to the paracetamol or ibuprofen before the codeine.
They could separate them, but I don’t think it’s common.
Also, poppies are stupid easy to grow, but nobody seems to bother recreationally, suggesting that ease of access was never a root cause.