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Starlink Is a Big Deal

sneak.berlin

131–140 of 365 posts

Re: Starlink Is a Big Deal

#131

> "Hundreds of cities and dozens of countries, fine for living but previously entirely unsuitable for a place of business, will blink from red to green on the map once Starlink goes live." this reads like a marketing piece rather than actual analysis. Throughput of a single satellite is 20Gbps. The finished constellation if I recall correctly is supposed to be about 12k satellites. So about ~250.000Gbps. So assuming…

On one hand, as other sibling posts are pointing out, you're comparing true network capacity with subscribed ("sold") capacity; those are massively different by orders of magnitude (depending on how shitty your ISP is.)

On the other hand, it's far worse than "20G per satellite." Bandwidth is limited by available RF spectrum, and that's not magically gonna increase with satellite count. Best thing they can try is limit the coverage area of each radio as much as possible, but there's limits to that and now you have an onslaught of handovers since the satellites are moving quite fast.

I honestly am too lazy to do the math, but my gut says this may work great for larger areas with lower population density (let's say the Amazon, U.S. Midwest, Australia, Sibiria, etc.) but it's not gonna replace high-density broadband access.

Also, just for comparison, current optical network technology (in the market, not research) puts 50G on a single wavelength on an optical fiber. There's 80 wavelengths in a medium-density DWDM setup, so that's 4T ... on a single strand. A low-density cable has 12 cores (that's what you deploy on the outskirts of your network), so, uh, 48 terabit/s with current technology. Infrastructure cables are commonly 144 cores, that's 576 terabit/s...

(These are obviously "maximum" numbers, you rarely see all 80 wavelengths or all 144 strands in use, and there's gonna be slower links like 10G occupying some wavelengths too.)

Re: Starlink Is a Big Deal

#132

I don’t understand how you can make functional satellites so small? That they can launch 60 at once. Usually a launch just has one satellite.

> can make functional satellites By reducing their "function" until they're basically a battery with a radio repeater strapped onto it. Obviously it's a bit more complicated, but there's very little these satellites actually have to _do_.

ion thruster, star trackers, phased array antennas, reaction wheels, torque rods, solar panels... they pretty much do everything every other satellite does.

Re: Starlink Is a Big Deal

#133
What this article didn't mention is the potential for this to significantly disrupt commercial internet monopolies in regional markets. If service is $45/ month for 100GB, a lot of people will drop Comcast in a hurry.

Re: Starlink Is a Big Deal

#134
post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Something is off with your analysis. At any given time, the vast majority of the people in a given city aren't all using 100 Mbps 24/7/365. For instance, my typical monthly mobile data consumption is around 4 GB, which is .0015 MB/s -- a far cry from 100!

Can you share what has led you to believe that you're the average rather than just an outlier?

For the average bandwidth usage of a city to be 100 MB/s per user, the average monthly total per user would have to be 263,974 GB. Obviously the real figure is much, much less than that.

Re: Starlink Is a Big Deal

#135

> "Hundreds of cities and dozens of countries, fine for living but previously entirely unsuitable for a place of business, will blink from red to green on the map once Starlink goes live." this reads like a marketing piece rather than actual analysis. Throughput of a single satellite is 20Gbps. The finished constellation if I recall correctly is supposed to be about 12k satellites. So about ~250.000Gbps. So assuming…

I'm also interested to see what kind of throughput they can achieve with a 'briefcase sized' terminal. Our company makes satellite terminals for military, and from that experience I can't really see the physics working for hundreds of Mbps with some type of panel antenna (phased array, etc.) that small at any kind of decent spectral/power efficiency...

All LEO internet providers have said they expect to use phased array antennae, which are not yet available at a consumer-friendly price.

Re: Starlink Is a Big Deal

#136

I'm not convinced that Starlink will provide access to the "half of the human beings (who) are not online yet." Of course that would be good, yet my guess is that Starlink will target people in developed nations who are in rural areas, or people who want low latency. Maybe Starlink could serve people w/o internet if a whole village buys a subscription, or if a cell provider uses Starlink as backhaul for voice? Still…

I suspect it will be an exclusive internet for Tesla customers at first.

Teslas mostly drive around in urban areas with too high of a density to be served by Starlink.

Re: Starlink Is a Big Deal

#137

> "Hundreds of cities and dozens of countries, fine for living but previously entirely unsuitable for a place of business, will blink from red to green on the map once Starlink goes live." this reads like a marketing piece rather than actual analysis. Throughput of a single satellite is 20Gbps. The finished constellation if I recall correctly is supposed to be about 12k satellites. So about ~250.000Gbps. So assuming…

I'm also interested to see what kind of throughput they can achieve with a 'briefcase sized' terminal. Our company makes satellite terminals for military, and from that experience I can't really see the physics working for hundreds of Mbps with some type of panel antenna (phased array, etc.) that small at any kind of decent spectral/power efficiency...

Last i heard they were definitely planning on phased array antennae

Re: Starlink Is a Big Deal

#138

Just going to plug my Starlink tracker here: https://james.darpinian.com/satellites/?special=starlink It tells you when to go outside and look up to see the satellites as they pass over your house. It's a cool sight to see because there are up to 60 of them crossing the sky at the same time in a line.

It tells you when to go outside and look up to see the satellites as they pass over your house This must be made up. I have been assured repeatedly on HN that Starlink is a visual non-factor, and that nobody would notice them in the sky, they won't get in the way of astronomy, stargazing, or just enjoying the night sky like humans have done for thousands of years.

The satellites are much more visible when they were just launched, when they are in a “low drag” configuration. It takes some time for them to reach operational altitude, at which point they shift to a “low brightness” configuration.

And I don’t think anyone ever (credibly) said they don’t affect astronomy. They do. Fortunately SpaceX is working with the astronomy community to minimize the effect.

If I do look up in the nights sky and see many faint little points, it’s still something to marvel at. But I think once at operational altitude they will be difficult to see with the naked eye.

Re: Starlink Is a Big Deal

#139
post #62

Just going to plug my Starlink tracker here: https://james.darpinian.com/satellites/?special=starlink It tells you when to go outside and look up to see the satellites as they pass over your house. It's a cool sight to see because there are up to 60 of them crossing the sky at the same time in a line.

It would be nice if I could select the location manually, since I don't like sharing my location directly by a prompt. When I got the location permission request I denied it and then it says there were no sightings available for the next 5 days :(

Yes this was my immediate thought. Especially if I want to check multiple locations for e.g. family. When I declined to share location I got an exception.

...suddenly I'm shy about listing my finger printable browser details online. I'll tell you I'm using brave.

I still can't use the app because the location denial is permanent, so I'll have to clear something in the browser...might be a bug worth addressing.

Edit 2: Jesus Christ man I had no idea I was giving you my fucking address. That's a little too granular for my taste, a warning would be nice. You could just use the zip code or prompt for the address, but seeing Google go straight to my address in streetview really rubs me the wrong way. I want to give you the benefit of the doubt but it looks like you're harvesting PII.

Re: Starlink Is a Big Deal

#140
post #114

Just going to plug my Starlink tracker here: https://james.darpinian.com/satellites/?special=starlink It tells you when to go outside and look up to see the satellites as they pass over your house. It's a cool sight to see because there are up to 60 of them crossing the sky at the same time in a line.

Oh that's great. Now I can better aim my Elon-Sattelite-fryer device. I already collected 25 old microwave ovens which I plan to operate as phased array to produce a collimated beam of microwaves directed at the satellites to fry their electronics. I might have a better chance If know the exact frequency their receivers are tuned to. Does anybody know more? The reckless littering of our precious LEO must end here!

The FTC would like a word.

This sounds like you are invoking Kessler Syndrome in LEO to protect the geostationary monopolies. Totally violates antitrust law.

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