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New coronavirus can spread between humans, but started in a wildlife market

nationalgeographic.com

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Re: New coronavirus can spread between humans, but started in a wildlife market

#31

Post by SomewhatLikely »

tempsy wrote: post #25
thisistheend123 wrote: post #7

President Xi has warned that the virus is spreading. His intervention seems to be unprecedented. Is it worse than what it seems to be? They have quarantined whole cities and are building a hospital at war scale especially for this. Maybe the Chinese know something that the world doesn't know yet.

I would be more concerned if the ones that are outside of China were dying at high rates. So far I haven’t heard any of those quarantined people actually dying. The ones in the US have been listed in fair condition and recovering.

The deaths are mostly among older ages, 60s, 70s, 80s. This group is probably less likely to be traveling.

Re: New coronavirus can spread between humans, but started in a wildlife market

#32

Post by nexuist »

DevX101 wrote: post #30

I'm bordering on conspiracy theory territory here, but I'd also like an real investigation into whether the virus actually originated from the Wuhan Biosafety Laboratory. It's the only level 4 (BSL-4 highest rating) lab in all of China designated to handle the most dangerous pathogens. And it's located 20 miles from the reported epicenter in the wildlife market. It was first opened two years ago and at the time multi…

> >The former Israeli military intelligence doctor also said suspicions were raised about the Wuhan Institute of Virology when a group of Chinese virologists working in Canada improperly sent samples to China of what he said were some of the deadliest viruses on earth, including the Ebola virus.

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2020/jan/24/virus-hit-w...

Re: New coronavirus can spread between humans, but started in a wildlife market

#34

Post by nerdponx »

cm2187 wrote: post #29
ppseafield wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not a dichotomy - removing animals from our diet does not leave a sterile environment for humans. Humans and their environment are plenty filthy on their own.

Then this is purely a vegan argument unrelated to the virus.

Again, not a dichotomy. Humans will remain exposed to pathogens even if we eliminate one source of new and dangerous ones.

Re: New coronavirus can spread between humans, but started in a wildlife market

#35

Post by turk73 »

DevX101 wrote: post #30

I'm bordering on conspiracy theory territory here, but I'd also like an real investigation into whether the virus actually originated from the Wuhan Biosafety Laboratory. It's the only level 4 (BSL-4 highest rating) lab in all of China designated to handle the most dangerous pathogens. And it's located 20 miles from the reported epicenter in the wildlife market. It was first opened two years ago and at the time multi…

It's just a coincidence that the apparent origin point, Wuhan, has this scary looking virus laboratory a la Steven King's "The Stand." Just a weird coincidence, right?

But also, how bad is China if there is a "wildlife market" in Wuhan where people go to eat exotic animals? WTF, China?

Re: New coronavirus can spread between humans, but started in a wildlife market

#36

Post by wallflower »

EndXA wrote: post #23

Key quote from the article: > “If we were to shut the wildlife markets, a lot of these outbreaks would be a thing of the past,” says Ian Lipkin, director of Columbia University’s Center for Infection and Immunity, whose lab worked with Chinese officials to develop early diagnostic tests for SARS. > That’s because both SARS and the new outbreak are zoonotic, meaning these diseases started in animals before spreading t…

> The earliest episodes were also among people who were more likely to live within walking distance of wildlife markets.

Also, the distance from the Wuhan wildlife market to the high-speed rail station is walking distance.

Re: New coronavirus can spread between humans, but started in a wildlife market

#37

Post by ComputerGuru »

tempsy wrote: post #25
thisistheend123 wrote: post #7

President Xi has warned that the virus is spreading. His intervention seems to be unprecedented. Is it worse than what it seems to be? They have quarantined whole cities and are building a hospital at war scale especially for this. Maybe the Chinese know something that the world doesn't know yet.

I would be more concerned if the ones that are outside of China were dying at high rates. So far I haven’t heard any of those quarantined people actually dying. The ones in the US have been listed in fair condition and recovering.

Dying at a high rate doesn’t matter if they do so quickly. That’s why Ebola has failed to become a global pandemic: it’s too potent and kills hosts before they have a chance to infect enough others.

Re: New coronavirus can spread between humans, but started in a wildlife market

#38

Post by ComputerGuru »

zbjornson wrote: post #2

I'm amazed that there's not a movement to stop eating and being around animals as much world-wide, given that so much disease (and environmental damage) comes from consumption of and proximity to animals: - MERS-CoV: bats via dromedary camels - nCoV-2019: bats or snakes? - Influenza: pigs, birds - E. coli O157:H7: cows and other farm animals. ... (Edit: I mean along the lines of how safer sex is encouraged to prevent…

Don’t forget AIDS, which has simian origins!

Re: New coronavirus can spread between humans, but started in a wildlife market

#39

Post by neffy »

DevX101 wrote: post #30

I'm bordering on conspiracy theory territory here, but I'd also like an real investigation into whether the virus actually originated from the Wuhan Biosafety Laboratory. It's the only level 4 (BSL-4 highest rating) lab in all of China designated to handle the most dangerous pathogens. And it's located 20 miles from the reported epicenter in the wildlife market. It was first opened two years ago and at the time multi…

I think it's a perfectly valid question, although the wildlife market is equally valid on the evidence we have. We know that the Chinese Government is hugely overreacting to public information at this point in time - terrible as the published numbers are they are not that out of whack with a normal bad flu epidemic, which also causes significantly higher death rates.

So it's either the actual death rates are higher (well, almost certainly), and/or they know or suspect something more serious.

Bearing in mind too, that even China doesn't trust China on reporting - witness the central committee order a few days ago to the regions to be accurate with reports or else.

Re: New coronavirus can spread between humans, but started in a wildlife market

#40

Post by onlyrealcuzzo »

DevX101 wrote: post #30

I'm bordering on conspiracy theory territory here, but I'd also like an real investigation into whether the virus actually originated from the Wuhan Biosafety Laboratory. It's the only level 4 (BSL-4 highest rating) lab in all of China designated to handle the most dangerous pathogens. And it's located 20 miles from the reported epicenter in the wildlife market. It was first opened two years ago and at the time multi…

The odds of this naturally occurring in China are probably close to 1 in 4. And the odds of it happening in Wuhan are probably close to 3%.

The odds of the Chinese government making a super virus based on Coronavirus seem smaller than that, and the odds of it escaping the laboratory might be decent, but when you combine them, it's pretty slim.

If this were some super strain of Smallpox, that would make a more convincing conspiracy.

The odds of there being some plausible conspiracy by now are high.

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