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NOAA Satellites Helped Save a Record 421 Lives in 2019

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Re: NOAA Satellites Helped Save a Record 421 Lives in 2019

#101

Post by thaumaturgy »

mjevans wrote: post #83
tlrobinson wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I have heard from other SAR groups that the beacons have been a mixed bag, and they're getting too many call-outs from people who just got tired and want a ride home. It seems like charging people for the cost of the rescue would solve that problem.

How about if a judge gets to decide if they are required to be force-enrolled in to a class that teaches safety in similarly fitting situations and/or some quantity of community service from a list of activities that are fitting of rehabilitation and improving the commons.

I'm pleased to say that a handful of past search subjects have gone on to become SAR volunteers themselves, so some people already do this without needing a judge's involvement.

Re: NOAA Satellites Helped Save a Record 421 Lives in 2019

#102

Post by paranoidrobot »

reaperducer wrote: post #37
jxcl wrote: post #2

I have one of these beacons and take it with me most times I'm going out alone into the wilderness. I don't want to be the guy who had to cut his own arm off after it got trapped by a falling boulder. That being said, this is an interesting spin on the number. I've been hearing from friends on Search and Rescue crews that an increasing number of people are going out hiking being completely unprepared for any possible…

I've been hearing from friends on Search and Rescue crews that an increasing number of people are going out hiking being completely unprepared for any possible emergency, thinking that they'll just use their cell phone if anything goes wrong. This is so true. I live in the desert, and it's amazing the number of people who simply don't take the natural world seriously. The dead and rescued are almost always tourists.…

We have a similar problem with tourists in Australia and people (even from the US) underestimating quite how large the country is, and how you can very quickly find yourself on roads not meant for campervans and regular cars, and on roads that rarely get travelled.

Last year about a few hours drive south of Sydney I found a very young German couple who were on a otherwise completely deserted and unpatrolled beach. They walked down from the parking spot to the beach and spent a few minutes wading around in the water.

After speaking to them, I found that they'd flown into the country the previous day, rented the van that morning and this was the first beach they had found. They said the only thing that kept them from swimming out was a worry of sharks. I had to spend a few minutes educating them about rip currents, and pointed out that they'd just been wading in what looked like the biggest one on the beach.

Re: NOAA Satellites Helped Save a Record 421 Lives in 2019

#103

Post by jonah »

The digital 406 MHz signals received by the satellites mentioned in TFA are unencrypted and can be receive by ground-based receivers as well.

There are commercial receivers/decoders[1] but you can also do it fairly easily with an appropriate antenna and SDR[2].

[1] https://wst.ca/beacon_monitor.html

[2] https://www.bytebang.at/Blog/ELT+Testing+with+rtl-sdr

Re: NOAA Satellites Helped Save a Record 421 Lives in 2019

#104

Post by AYBABTME »

throw0101a wrote: post #33
AYBABTME wrote: post #11

I bought one of these PLBs after spending 12h down a canyon with a broken ankle and no cell reception. Friends had to hike back out of the canyon and hike then drive for hours to get help. Never again. Since then I got a sailboat and it's pretty standard in that field to have EPIRB, PLBs and the likes. There's life-vests that come with mini-PLBs in them. It's a bit pricey but it's essential in my opinion. I was lucky…

> Since then I got a sailboat Depending on where and with whom you sail, getting a DSC/AIS-based beacon may make sense: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AIS-SART If you're mostly in coastal waters, and not short-handed, then help is probably not far away, and being able to see where a person is floating on a chart plotter display makes for easier retrieval. * http://oceansignal.com/products/mob1/ Of course if you're d…

Agreed.

Re: NOAA Satellites Helped Save a Record 421 Lives in 2019

#105

Post by AYBABTME »

bagacrap wrote: post #74
AYBABTME wrote: post #11

I bought one of these PLBs after spending 12h down a canyon with a broken ankle and no cell reception. Friends had to hike back out of the canyon and hike then drive for hours to get help. Never again. Since then I got a sailboat and it's pretty standard in that field to have EPIRB, PLBs and the likes. There's life-vests that come with mini-PLBs in them. It's a bit pricey but it's essential in my opinion. I was lucky…

They had to drive for hours to get into cell reception? I mean yeah that's pretty remote. Most people probably never get hundreds of miles from the nearest cell tower though. Now if you were all alone, I could see how it would have been crucial.

America is large and there's ton of remote places. In sparsely populated areas, like in the deserts, there's a lot of roads that end up with no reception. This was in Southern Utah.

Re: NOAA Satellites Helped Save a Record 421 Lives in 2019

#106

Post by alfalfasprout »

thaumaturgy wrote: post #62
jxcl wrote: post #2

I have one of these beacons and take it with me most times I'm going out alone into the wilderness. I don't want to be the guy who had to cut his own arm off after it got trapped by a falling boulder. That being said, this is an interesting spin on the number. I've been hearing from friends on Search and Rescue crews that an increasing number of people are going out hiking being completely unprepared for any possible…

I'm in search and rescue near the Tahoe area. So far we've had good luck with beacon call-outs. The cases we've responded to have almost entirely been folks that were legitimately stuck or lost, and yes, they were somewhat under-prepared for the situation they were in, but that's just the modern reality of outdoor play and it makes no more sense to expect all recreationists to be perfectly prepared than it makes to e…

What are your thoughts on two-way communicators eg; inReach? I've largely replaced my PLB with an inReach (though when in a group I have another person carry the PLB) because in an emergency situation I can communicate with rescuers about the exact nature of the emergency.

Eg; if I need an air evac vs. I broke my leg and can't walk out. Or if I can get medical advice from a rescuer. Similarly I can communicate dangers the rescuers may face.

Re: NOAA Satellites Helped Save a Record 421 Lives in 2019

#107

Post by dsfyu404ed »

thaumaturgy wrote: post #98
tlrobinson wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I have heard from other SAR groups that the beacons have been a mixed bag, and they're getting too many call-outs from people who just got tired and want a ride home. It seems like charging people for the cost of the rescue would solve that problem.

SAR and Mountain Rescue Association groups are almost entirely opposed to any form of pay-for-rescue, including the kind of "negligence fines" that a few agencies like New Hampshire's Fish and Game department levies. It's not just a theoretical possibility that people will hesitate to call for rescue if they think they'll be charged for it, it's something that has already happened in a lot of cases. When people delay…

I agree in the general case but NH has a special situation since most of the people falling down ravines trying to take the perfect selfie are from outside their taxing jurisdiction (so it's not like they're footing the bill at the end of the day) and much of their government operations are funded by fees at/near the point of service (as opposed to from taxes) so having a "rescue fee" kind of makes sense for them.

Re: NOAA Satellites Helped Save a Record 421 Lives in 2019

#108

Post by alfalfasprout »

scarejunba wrote: post #82
stopads wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is really cool, I had no idea these exist and are somewhat affordable. For example: https://www.amazon.com/Resqlink-PLB-375-Personal-Locator-Buo... I'm going to pick something like this up before my next Wyoming adventure.

Almost all the reviews for these are "haven't had to use". Look at this product https://www.amazon.com/ACR-ResQLink-400-Buoyant-Personal/dp/... 13 5-star ratings - everyone should have one, I haven't had to use mine but it gives me peace of mind 1 1-star rating - gave it to my son because he jet skis. After a while it was rusted. Gave it a shot, didn't work. Reminds me of this xkcd https://xkcd.com/937/

In the ResQLink manual it literally has you test it several times per year to verify correct operation. FWIW I've had mine 7 years and it's been through several battery replacements at the factory and been through several rough longer expeditions. No problems at all with the GPS test cycle.

Re: NOAA Satellites Helped Save a Record 421 Lives in 2019

#109

Post by thaumaturgy »

alfalfasprout wrote: post #106
thaumaturgy wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm in search and rescue near the Tahoe area. So far we've had good luck with beacon call-outs. The cases we've responded to have almost entirely been folks that were legitimately stuck or lost, and yes, they were somewhat under-prepared for the situation they were in, but that's just the modern reality of outdoor play and it makes no more sense to expect all recreationists to be perfectly prepared than it makes to e…

What are your thoughts on two-way communicators eg; inReach? I've largely replaced my PLB with an inReach (though when in a group I have another person carry the PLB) because in an emergency situation I can communicate with rescuers about the exact nature of the emergency. Eg; if I need an air evac vs. I broke my leg and can't walk out. Or if I can get medical advice from a rescuer. Similarly I can communicate danger…

LOVE InReach and we recommend 'em to anybody that can handle the sticker shock.

Re: NOAA Satellites Helped Save a Record 421 Lives in 2019

#110

Post by xattt »

wongarsu wrote: post #63
davidw wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm sure there are remote places in Europe There are a few, here and there, but it's just completely different. Everywhere in Italy (I lived there a number of years) there are people. It might just be a little mountain hut, or a cabin or something, but there are pretty much always other people around. Here in Oregon, I can ride my bike to places where I almost won't see other people all day.

For further context, [1] is a map of worldwide population density. Except for the Nordic countries and Spain there are no places without people. 1: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/67/World_po...

That map is missing data. Thunder Bay, Ontario is a densely populated area, yet not represented on the map.
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