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Why Engineers Are Better Off Joining Startups

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Re: Why Engineers Are Better Off Joining Startups

#11

Post by toxicflavor »

homecoded wrote: post #8
toxicflavor wrote: post #3

I would say the only startup worth working on is your own. Working at someone else's startup is a recipe for getting exploited - overworked and underpaid. And the worst thing about it is that it's all couched in an atmosphere of guilt trips and taking-it-for-the-team. Perhaps there are exceptions. I just haven't seen any. I'd rather work for The Man in my day job in a cold corporate environment where everything is ex…

I totally agree! I'd even go one step further and say that you'll be "overworked and underpaid" even at your own start-up. I just had that. No fun! Right now I am going back to a regular day job. And I'm actually looking forward to it. I'm still going to work on new projects ... but I'll do that in my spare-time also.

Absolutely. But there's something about being "overworked and underpaid" on your own startup that's easier to stomach.

Re: Why Engineers Are Better Off Joining Startups

#12

Post by gasull »

toxicflavor wrote: post #3

I would say the only startup worth working on is your own. Working at someone else's startup is a recipe for getting exploited - overworked and underpaid. And the worst thing about it is that it's all couched in an atmosphere of guilt trips and taking-it-for-the-team. Perhaps there are exceptions. I just haven't seen any. I'd rather work for The Man in my day job in a cold corporate environment where everything is ex…

It is also possible and very common to be self-exploited, overworked and underpaid at your own startup. And depending on the exit of your startup vs the exit of someone else's startup, and the % you get from the total of outstanding shares in both cases, you might be better off joining a startup than working on your own.

And as the article points out it's getting less risky working for a startup, while working on your own you might need to spend your savings on it.

Re: Why Engineers Are Better Off Joining Startups

#13

Post by homecoded »

toxicflavor wrote: post #11
homecoded wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I totally agree! I'd even go one step further and say that you'll be "overworked and underpaid" even at your own start-up. I just had that. No fun! Right now I am going back to a regular day job. And I'm actually looking forward to it. I'm still going to work on new projects ... but I'll do that in my spare-time also.

Absolutely. But there's something about being "overworked and underpaid" on your own startup that's easier to stomach.

Well put.

Re: Why Engineers Are Better Off Joining Startups

#14

Post by toxicflavor »

gasull wrote: post #12
toxicflavor wrote: post #3

I would say the only startup worth working on is your own. Working at someone else's startup is a recipe for getting exploited - overworked and underpaid. And the worst thing about it is that it's all couched in an atmosphere of guilt trips and taking-it-for-the-team. Perhaps there are exceptions. I just haven't seen any. I'd rather work for The Man in my day job in a cold corporate environment where everything is ex…

It is also possible and very common to be self-exploited, overworked and underpaid at your own startup. And depending on the exit of your startup vs the exit of someone else's startup, and the % you get from the total of outstanding shares in both cases, you might be better off joining a startup than working on your own. And as the article points out it's getting less risky working for a startup, while working on you…

There's something about the feeling of self-determination - directing your own fate - that makes the hard work of your own startup more tolerable, even if, from a mathematical standpoint, you would profit more from working for someone else.

And, sure, it might be getting less risky to work for (someone else's) startup. But I don't think the culture of the startup work environment has changed much recently with respect to the unfettered expectations of your work output and willingness to self-sacrifice for the "larger cause" - regardless of how counter-productive that self-sacrifice may actually be.

Re: Why Engineers Are Better Off Joining Startups

#15

Post by gasull »

toxicflavor wrote: post #14
gasull wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is also possible and very common to be self-exploited, overworked and underpaid at your own startup. And depending on the exit of your startup vs the exit of someone else's startup, and the % you get from the total of outstanding shares in both cases, you might be better off joining a startup than working on your own. And as the article points out it's getting less risky working for a startup, while working on you…

There's something about the feeling of self-determination - directing your own fate - that makes the hard work of your own startup more tolerable, even if, from a mathematical standpoint, you would profit more from working for someone else. And, sure, it might be getting less risky to work for (someone else's) startup. But I don't think the culture of the startup work environment has changed much recently with respec…

I agree, but working for the startup of someone else you might learn from an awesome team that will prepare you for one day having your own startup. This was the advice of D'Angelo, from Quora, at the last Startup School.

I think it all depends on how prepared you are. If you think you have already learned enough, then go for it.

So, good luck with your startup! :)

Re: Why Engineers Are Better Off Joining Startups

#16

Post by toxicflavor »

gasull wrote: post #15
toxicflavor wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's something about the feeling of self-determination - directing your own fate - that makes the hard work of your own startup more tolerable, even if, from a mathematical standpoint, you would profit more from working for someone else. And, sure, it might be getting less risky to work for (someone else's) startup. But I don't think the culture of the startup work environment has changed much recently with respec…

I agree, but working for the startup of someone else you might learn from an awesome team that will prepare you for one day having your own startup. This was the advice of D'Angelo, from Quora, at the last Startup School. I think it all depends on how prepared you are. If you think you have already learned enough, then go for it. So, good luck with your startup! :)

I guess it depends where you are in life and how valuable a potential learning experience with a good team might be for you.

My feeling is there is no greater motivator for learning than when the problems you face may have a direct bearing on your own financial well-being and the life or death of your own startup.

Re: Why Engineers Are Better Off Joining Startups

#17

Post by jat850 »

toxicflavor wrote: post #9
wallflower wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'd rather work for The Man in my day job in a cold corporate environment where everything is explicit from the get-go, get well paid for it and crank out code for my own startup in my free time. I agree (for now). Cautionary, related thread: "Does my company have IP rights to the stuff I do in my spare time?" http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2208056

Questions about IP rights for side projects only becomes an issue if your outside work is traceable to you. There's not much discussion in that thread of flying under the radar.

I don't know that flying under the radar is a sound legal or business strategy (at least not forever).

Re: Why Engineers Are Better Off Joining Startups

#18

Post by zwieback »

acgourley wrote: post #10

A lot of these discussions gloss over the fact that engineers can have wildly different personalities and life circumstances. At least in SV where all engineers seem aware of their opportunities to start a business, work at startupco, or work at bigco, they efficiently sort themselves into the buckets they should be in.

... and interests. If you're in software there's a lot more flexibility but if you're going to build something with complex electronics or even mechanical elements you may be better off at a larger or even huge company.
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