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U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

reuters.com

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Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#351

Post by cosmodisk »

nate_meurer wrote: post #214

Meanwhile, these same PFAS chemicals are sprayed liberally onto the surface of clothing that we all wear, and increasingly furniture as well, and this may account for far more human PFAS consumption than drinking water. PFAS chemicals are widely used for waterproofing fabrics. The industry term is DWR -- Durable Water Repellent. The chemicals are sprayed onto the surface and simply left there to rub off on your hands…

Wasn't aware of any of this.It looks like it's as bad as fire retardants used in furniture ( California,if I recall correctly, alows selling furniture without them). In the UK, about 30 or so deaths a year happen because furniture gets set on fire( I suppose drinking + smoking is the main reason).Because of this, everything,from chairs all the way to sofas are soaked in chemicals that cause cancer and many other issues to humans.I'm sure chemical industry is lobbying as hell for this to continue, however the bastards themselves end up using the same harmful products.

Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#352

Post by ip26 »

sizzle wrote: post #347
ip26 wrote: post #338

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gore-tex does stay waterproof. It just can't breathe once the outer fabric soaks through, which results in clamminess. DWR delays this & keeps it breathable for longer in wet conditions. Gore is not a great solution if you'll be drowning in rain but for intermittent showers, meltwater and snow it has time to dry out. Especially if you're moving & generating heat.

What is a better engineered membrane than gore-tex?

I'm not sure what you mean, but pretty much all breathable membrane systems in clothing work this way, depending on DWR to maintain breathability.

The one radical entrant in the market is gore shakedry, which is pretty simple- the face fabric is omitted, and therefore the need for DWR. The exterior of the jacket is literally the gore membrane. The moisture performance is reportedly superior. The consequence is extremely poor durability against abrasion, to the point you cannot wear a pack over it.

Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#353

Post by jakeogh »

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #294
anigbrowl wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Questionable. After all, it's often the elites whipping said masses up to fury, a trend which continues today in more systematic fashion.

They have to do that to build a voting bloc: Feign alignment with the disenfranchised masses to win elections. Then enact policies that reinforce their rancor.

The "well fare" system, AKA putting people on the take, and it's latest iteration "universal free money" are exceptionally powerful control structures.

Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#354

Post by [deleted] »

NeedMoreTea wrote: post #341
strainer wrote: post #317

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gore-tex (at least the heavy 'classic' kind) doesn't have any refreshable coating. Its an inner layer of moisture wicking mesh, stuck to a thin rubbery ptfe membrane of some sort and an outer very abrasion resistant layer which is hydrophobic when clean. It can be boil washed and special treatments are advised against. It is very waterproof while surprisingly breathable.

Hmm, as far as I can remember, every gore-tex item I've owned across the decades -- mainly from the better outdoorsy brands -- has needed a refresh, and warned to expect that on the label or leaflet. Some lasted longer than others. One that was left far too long without eventually gave about as much water protection as a cotton jacket. Whether any of them were "classic" gore-tex or not, I don't know. I've always unde…

[deleted]

Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#355

Post by xyzzyz »

kasey_junk wrote: post #349
tptacek wrote: post #348

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't this a little like saying "in part that's due to the fact that conservatives are persuasive"?

Yes. But I think you can also attribute some of it to “the rich* have weaponized conservative politics.” They have the most leverage so a minority opinion can show outsized results. *apply all appropriate modifiers about not all rich etc

Where's their leverage? In media, which is dominated by liberals? Or in academia, which is dominated by them even more overwhelmingly? Where exactly are all these powerful conservative voices? Is Fox News and Breitbart so much better at getting their message across than almost everything else?

Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#356

Post by benmccann »

abandonliberty wrote: post #221
chrisjc wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've heard this also removes many essential minerals that we get from water?

Yes, googling "reverse osmosis demineralized water" provides many options to add minerals back in. The WHO stated that demineralized water is unsuitable for long term drinking due to the lack of minerals. Not sure how significant this is or how many minerals you can get from diet instead of water.

Here's the WHO report for folks who are interested: https://www.who.int/water_sanitation_health/dwq/nutrientscha...

Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#357

Post by hnick »

ip26 wrote: post #220
nate_meurer wrote: post #214

Meanwhile, these same PFAS chemicals are sprayed liberally onto the surface of clothing that we all wear, and increasingly furniture as well, and this may account for far more human PFAS consumption than drinking water. PFAS chemicals are widely used for waterproofing fabrics. The industry term is DWR -- Durable Water Repellent. The chemicals are sprayed onto the surface and simply left there to rub off on your hands…

It's even in those "compostable" curiously-grease-proof bowls you see at Qdoba, Chipotle, etc. https://grist.org/article/chipotle-sweetgreen-bowl-compost-p...

I recently learned a lot of 'compostable' plasticky items are not bio-degradable. They rely on a technicality to say they can be composted after being pre-treated or broken down with another chemical or process. Or something ridiculous of the sort.

Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#359

Post by hnick »

nate_meurer wrote: post #292
mark-r wrote: post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consider what happens to your immune system when it detects a foreign particle that it can't get rid of because there's no way to interact with it.

For the most part, what happens is nothing. PTFE is completely biologically inert, which is why it's commonly used in surgical implants and prosthetics. Only the finest particles ( Ingested PTFE passes right through the digestive system unaltered. You can scrape the non-stick coating off of all your pans and eat it, and there will no detectable fluorinated chemicals in your blood. However, if you heat that nonstick p…

Adam Ragusea on YouTube (can't link sorry, restricted browsing) had a short video covering this as he reviewed the cases and research from experts. In the end the worst known case was basically a guy who fell asleep and the entire coating of his pan burned off, filling his house with smoke. He had respiratory symptoms and was hospitalised but walked out (I think) less than 48 hours later with no obvious lasting effects.

I think the post you are replying to though was angling that it would cause a sustained inflammation response as your immune system is detecting and gearing up to fight a particle it cannot deal with. I have no idea if that's true though.

Re: U.S. drinking water widely contaminated with 'forever chemicals': report

#360

Post by hammock »

germinalphrase wrote: post #314
hammock wrote: post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Add for clarity: Goretex (like all modern waterproof-breathable products) is a system, which includes a PTFE membrane, as well as a DWR coating. The fabric is not breathable without the DWR coating, as it will "wet out."

Breathability is as much a marketing feature as it is a useful property of these garments/fabrics. Do they work well in cold/dry conditions? Yes! Do they work well in warm humid conditions (i.e. your average North America. Rainy day)? Not so much.

How old are you? The key feature is not breathability but "waterproof+breathable." You might not be old enough to remember airtight rubber raingear, or questionably waterproof oilskin, or horribly "water resistant" synthetics.

You also might not be into gear enough to have realized the significant spectrum of breathability between a nylon jacket, a 2.5 layer jacket, and a fully 3-ply goretex pro.

It is a real thing, not marketing, for many who care about and rely on these things for comfort and safety.

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