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What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

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Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#361

Post by asah »

sschueller wrote: post #207
dmode wrote: post #160

Why can’t we have normal businesses where you employ your workers and charge your customers the real cost of the transaction ? If that is not viable, don’t start the business to begin with. Let’s just go back to first principles, can we ?

We can, stop using and supporting these predatory companies. Never use Uber, Lyft, Doordash, Uber Eats, AirBnB etc. No exception irregardless how easy or cheap it may be. It's a small sacrifice but can and will make a difference. Using these services to me is like asking a waiter to pay for part of my meal. When it comes around to paying the bill are you able to face someone and ask them to pay for part of what they…

We can, but..

- incumbent taxis are also predatory services that abuse drivers, arguably worse than Uber/Lyft - and they're a shitty rider experience in many many ways.

- hotels are OK but rarely provide kitchens, let alone friendly hosts who bake you killer banana bread (yesterday's stay)

- delivery from individual restaurants is rarely available at all, and thus you're going to call a Postmates/etc to help pickup. Delivery is all-but-required when feeding a large group, e.g. work function.

Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#362

Post by ramraj07 »

frobozz wrote: post #303
ramraj07 wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not completely. I remember life before Uber and seamless. I'd just stay home and eat ramen (this is in Dallas and I didn't have a car). These businesses did genuinely create businesses and also changed lives for many by the service. That's not an excuse for such exploitative behavior of course.

I remember life before Uber and I'd never heard of Seamless, until your comment. These businesses genuinely just used VC funding and exploitative contracts to undercut perfectly viable existing services. Before Uber, I'd take public transport, phone for a minicab or walk to their office to get one. (and I still do) Before Deliveroo, I'd call the local takeaway and get them to deliver, or walk there and collect it mys…

Looks like you haven't lived in a city like Dallas. Public transport is a joke (which I did resort to when I finally run out of food; will take me half a day to do groceries and I need to come back home and shower). Cabs will take thirty minutes to come to your home and will charge outrageous amounts (4x what Uber used to charge initially).

When I say I'd just sit at home I wasn't joking. I and many friends (mostly women) would just not do shit most of the time and just watch TV instead. Hell I'd go years without visiting my cousin in Plano (a suburb) because commuting there is a multi day ordeal (I need to start from their home at 5 pm if I needed to use public transport).

Did I and others just exploit Ubers unreasonably cheap prices? Yes. Did it improbe our lives measurably? Also yes. If you were lucky enough to live in New York or some city like that power to you but not every place was blessed.

Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#363

Post by save_ferris »

why-oh-why wrote: post #360

It’s kind of surprising that anyone who works for these services for more than one day keeps working in these conditions. If you made $50 in one day and spent $40 in gas, why work again? Does Doordash pay more initially to “get them hooked?” It’s definitely predatory practices of people who don’t understand that, after a day of work, you should have more money than what you spent.

In some cases, people value the flexibility. In other cases, there aren’t a lot of better options for people.

> it’s definitely predatory practices of people who don’t understand that

I find it hard to believe that after so many gig economy apps have been scrutinized over this, they simply don’t understand. Some of them have to understand, and just don’t care, because they’re trying to cash in on their equity.

Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#364

Post by dboreham »

dmode wrote: post #160

Why can’t we have normal businesses where you employ your workers and charge your customers the real cost of the transaction ? If that is not viable, don’t start the business to begin with. Let’s just go back to first principles, can we ?

Because humans love them some Faustian bargain.

Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#365

Post by asdfasgasdgasdg »

mlyle wrote: post #187
asdfasgasdgasdg wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am curious about how they selected workers to sample. If the advertisement was, "Pissed about your DoorDash wages? Share them with us!" or anything similar, I'm not sure what conclusions can be drawn from the analysis.

Though it's not likely too distorted, because the average hourly gross pay was similar to what DoorDash cites [we can't tell how close because DD doesn't explain their exact methodology]; just the net pay is very low.

I reread the article. What's super distorted is how they're calculating expenses. Sure the IRS will let you deduct 58c per mile, but that doesn't mean that's what it actually costs. Unless you're stupid, you use an intelligent car like a used Corolla or Fit for a job like this. Maybe a nicely used Prius. A sensible driver would incur expenses of about 20c per mile.

So that means their estimate of expenses is about 200% higher than what it should be. Since they don't really provide sufficient data to recalculate their estimates, it's hard to say exactly what effect this might have on their conclusions, but it probably changes them significantly.

Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#366

Post by ganeshkrishnan »

franga2000 wrote: post #299
wolco wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Canada, Africa and the Middle East.

Why do I keep expecting Canada to be better than it actually is? Although, a quick web search shows that at least in Quebec, minimum wage for tipped workers is 1.9$ lower vs. not applying at all in many US states - better, but still sad.

I moved from US to Australia and then Canada. Canada is almost the same as US with consumer rights, customer service, citizen rights etc which is that's it's almost non existent.

Australia is one of the best countries imo. Minimum wage with penalty can be up to as high as $100 per hour ( yes $100) and starts around $25+

Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#367

Post by reaperducer »

Drakar1903 wrote: post #267
sschueller wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We can, stop using and supporting these predatory companies. Never use Uber, Lyft, Doordash, Uber Eats, AirBnB etc. No exception irregardless how easy or cheap it may be. It's a small sacrifice but can and will make a difference. Using these services to me is like asking a waiter to pay for part of my meal. When it comes around to paying the bill are you able to face someone and ask them to pay for part of what they…

You could book an Uber to two streets away and tell the driver that you actually want to go to somewhere else, and you'll pay the guy under the table. Bet they won't mind that.

Illegal. At least where and when I drove for Uber. And there were plenty of local government inspectors posing as passengers trying to catch these sorts of shenanigans.

Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#368

Post by fouc »

sschueller wrote: post #207
dmode wrote: post #160

Why can’t we have normal businesses where you employ your workers and charge your customers the real cost of the transaction ? If that is not viable, don’t start the business to begin with. Let’s just go back to first principles, can we ?

We can, stop using and supporting these predatory companies. Never use Uber, Lyft, Doordash, Uber Eats, AirBnB etc. No exception irregardless how easy or cheap it may be. It's a small sacrifice but can and will make a difference. Using these services to me is like asking a waiter to pay for part of my meal. When it comes around to paying the bill are you able to face someone and ask them to pay for part of what they…

OYO hotels seems like another one based on this model. Heck maybe avoid most or all of the SoftBank funded startups?

Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#369

Post by kennyadam »

tremon wrote: post #309
franga2000 wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any other country other than the US where paying service workers below minimum wage is legal or acceptable? I've been around a fair bit of Europe and surroundings and I've never encountered the US system.

While not legally the same, the UK comes close with its minimum wage/living wage gap: society acknowledges that minimum wage is not enough to make a living (in some areas) so it expects workers to be paid the living wage instead. I don't think this is mandated by law though, so you could have situations where workers are paid below the socially expected "minimum" wage. At least they acknowledge the problem.

'We' also renamed the minimum wage to the National Living Wage because the tories.

Re: What DoorDash pays, after expenses, and what’s happening with tips

#370

Post by squiggleblaz »

According to the article, the standard delivery fee is 5.99 and there's a 10% service charge. Surely the purchaser thinks "I'm paying 5.99 to the driver and 10% to DoorDash". It feels like theft. The company is telling the customer one thing, the driver another thing, and stealing the difference.
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