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How Swedes were fooled by the book “Surrounded by Idiots”

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Re: How Swedes were fooled by the book “Surrounded by Idiots”

#21
Even Myers-Briggs is considered to be very problematic.

I think the only personality elements fairly well backed by Science are the 'big 5': Conscientiousness, Extraversion, Neuroticism, Agreeableness, Openness to Experience.

It's fundamentally scary that any advanced nation would be taken in by any of this.

Re: How Swedes were fooled by the book “Surrounded by Idiots”

#22
post #9

> · Red: dominant, driven, solution focussed. > · Blue: analytic, careful, meticulous > · Green: patient, considerate, nice > · Yellow: extroverted, creative, verbal Damn. I spent so much of my time and energy pushing back exactly on this bullshit when I was young. That's part of the curriculum of mandatory courses I had to take during an apprenticeship in Switzerland. Expensive and mandatory courses paid by students…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neuro-linguistic_programming

Re: How Swedes were fooled by the book “Surrounded by Idiots”

#24
post #8

Is it not the same for the current wave of anti-bias/discrimination/racism training? There is zero evidence that it has any effect. What few brave researchers have risked their careers exploring the effectiveness of the training have found that it does basically nothing. None of that stops companies from paying millions for it and good luck to the employee or executive that even dares suggest that perhaps there's bet…

The training is largely for legal purposes. If someone needs to be fired for whatever it has to be demonstrated that they were 'trained' on the basis of that issue.

Re: How Swedes were fooled by the book “Surrounded by Idiots”

#25
post #8

Is it not the same for the current wave of anti-bias/discrimination/racism training? There is zero evidence that it has any effect. What few brave researchers have risked their careers exploring the effectiveness of the training have found that it does basically nothing. None of that stops companies from paying millions for it and good luck to the employee or executive that even dares suggest that perhaps there's bet…

The problem is that the people suggesting the better ways are usually... promoting rather unpalatable ideas. Often either that there is no discrimination in the workplace ever and so we should stop talking about it, or that discrimination in the workplace is in fact normal and healthy.

I'd love to see a way of creating healthy, non-discriminatory workplaces, especially in industries that are usually pretty terrible.

Re: How Swedes were fooled by the book “Surrounded by Idiots”

#26

I got this book as a Christmas present from my mom. Then I ran into the same argument about pseudoscience that we have each year...

I gave it as a Christmas gift two years ago. Picked it up because of the funny title, saw that it was backed up by "science" according to the back cover and bought it... just apologized for the crappy gift to my brother in law.

We were all confused by the colors. I had a little bit of all colors. My mom used to be red but is now more of the other colors... it really is pretty useless.

I still enjoy taking "personality tests" but I try not fooling myself into thinking that MBTI, Strengths Finder, or DiSC says much more about myself than a horoscope would. If anything it might tell me a little bit about how I perceive myself, but that's not how it's sold.

Thanks to VoF for their work!

Re: How Swedes were fooled by the book “Surrounded by Idiots”

#28
post #8

Is it not the same for the current wave of anti-bias/discrimination/racism training? There is zero evidence that it has any effect. What few brave researchers have risked their careers exploring the effectiveness of the training have found that it does basically nothing. None of that stops companies from paying millions for it and good luck to the employee or executive that even dares suggest that perhaps there's bet…

It may in fact make things worse.

>The Implicit Association Test has been used in online studies to assess implicit racial attitudes in over seven million participants. Although typically used as an assessment measure, results from four pre-registered experiments (N = 940) demonstrated that completing a Race IAT exacerbates the negative implicit attitudes that it seeks to assess. Increases in White participants’ negative automatic racial evaluations of Black people were observed across two different implicit measures (SC-IAT and AMP) but did not generalize to another measure of automatic racial bias (Shooter Bias task). Results highlight an important caveat for the Race IAT, but also for many other forms of psychological assessment: that by measuring, we often perturb the system that we wish to understand.

https://psyarxiv.com/vxsj7/

Re: How Swedes were fooled by the book “Surrounded by Idiots”

#29
post #8

Is it not the same for the current wave of anti-bias/discrimination/racism training? There is zero evidence that it has any effect. What few brave researchers have risked their careers exploring the effectiveness of the training have found that it does basically nothing. None of that stops companies from paying millions for it and good luck to the employee or executive that even dares suggest that perhaps there's bet…

Not only does it do nothing, but the purported problem—implicit association tests (IATs) “demonstrating” a high degree of racism in an organization or individual—is artificial: the IATs are themselves fraudulent; there is no evidence whatsoever that they measure racism at all. https://www.thecut.com/2017/01/psychologys-racism-measuring-...

EDIT: Downvoters, what's wrong with this comment? Are downvotes disagreement? If so, do you have anything to substantiate your position? If it's not disagreement, what could I do to improve the quality of my post to make it acceptable?

Re: How Swedes were fooled by the book “Surrounded by Idiots”

#30
post #2

Couldn't help but check that it is rated 4.6/5 (113 reviews) in Amazon. https://www.amazon.com/Surrounded-Idiots-Behavior-Effectivel... Excerpt from one of the top review.. The book really helps you to understand why 'blues' ask 100 questions, want to problem solve all the time, always ask for more information, and can be cold and distant instead of being emotional creatures. Yellows on the other hand are always day…

Doesn't look too different from most "self-help" books out there.
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