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The new Microsoft Edge is out of preview

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Re: The new Microsoft Edge is out of preview

#241

Post by mook »

techsupporter wrote: post #39
hybrids wrote: post #28

I get why Microsoft did what they did. I just still wish they would have at least OSS'd EdgeHTML instead of just shoving it in a closet somewhere.

I wish they had thrown in with helping Firefox instead of handing even more web influence over to Google. A percentage of what Microsoft spent on EdgeHTML contributed to the Firefox project—ideally as employee time—would go a long way, along with the counterbalance of putting the Firefox engine and code base front and center of more Windows users.

Unfortunately historically there was a history of Mozilla not being a very stable platform to develop on top of (though I have no idea if Chromium was worse). There had been at least two separate embedding APIs that have been abandoned (the original one in the ActiveX control era and the external one after they moved to Hg), at least three Electron-like things (prism, XULRunner, and positron), and the field of corpses of Mozilla-based apps (I've worked for two, there were lots more).

Maybe they're better at API backwards compatibility now? Not sure; I'm unlikely to try again given previous experience. Which is a shame; I still use Firefox since it was called Phoenix…

If anybody has more recent experience working on their stack, I'd be happy to be correctly though. Preferably with examples of projects that _haven't_ been burned.

Re: The new Microsoft Edge is out of preview

#242

Post by techntoke »

crazygringo wrote: post #231
altitudinous wrote: post #127

On MacOS it requires admin privilege to install. I am done with that after all the crap that previous software with admin rights installed. I cleaned it up and swore I would not install anything that required admin rights again - for my own security and peace of mind. What does it need admin rights for?

Seriously, that bugs the hell out of me too. Why do I need to give Adobe admin rights to install Photoshop? Why do I need to give Microsoft the same to install Word? And now for a web browser? If I'm installing something low-level like a window manager or a keyboard shortcut tool, I get it . But for a normal mainstream flagship consumer application, what on earth do they need admin privileges for?! I hate the fact I…

So that it can be used my multiple users. There are ways to install as a user without admin privileges.

Re: The new Microsoft Edge is out of preview

#243

Post by rejectfinite »

Rapzid wrote: post #158

Tested it out a few weeks ago and discovered Netflix was limiting the streaming bitrate on it. Turns out Chrome and Edge can play at 1080p now, but the bitrate is reduced(much) over what I see in Safari and the Netflix app on Windows.

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/edge/features

Says it is 4k in Netflix now

* 4K Ultra HD exclusivity is limited to PCs running Windows 10. 4K works in both Microsoft Edge and Netflix app. Only 7th Gen Intel® Core™ processor or higher devices can decrypt PlayReady 4K DRM. Netflix Ultra HD plan required.

Re: The new Microsoft Edge is out of preview

#244

Post by eyelidlessness »

altitudinous wrote: post #127

On MacOS it requires admin privilege to install. I am done with that after all the crap that previous software with admin rights installed. I cleaned it up and swore I would not install anything that required admin rights again - for my own security and peace of mind. What does it need admin rights for?

You can inspect (and extract) it with Pacifist[1] without using admin privileges.

[1] https://www.charlessoft.com/

Re: The new Microsoft Edge is out of preview

#245

Post by fbelzile »

dessant wrote: post #99

I have published some of my extensions for the new Edge browser on their store [1], the submission experience was straightforward and pleasant, and the extensions were published in a couple of days after manual review. Updates were also reviewed and published in a timely manner. More importantly, during extension submissions and reviews I did not feel abused as a developer, something which I cannot say about the Chro…

Is this a different store from the "old" Edge?

The "old" Edge store was utterly mismanaged [0]. I'm glad they've improved if this one is different, but they definitely left a sour taste in my mouth.

[0] I required Native App Messaging and needed to include a 32 bit binary to read an SQLite database. The extension was rejected and was only told to wait while they worked on this feature (which was already in a tutorial I was following). Nobody ever contacted me back for over a year until the news broke that they were moving to Chromium.

Re: The new Microsoft Edge is out of preview

#246

Post by mariushn »

robbrown451 wrote: post #138

This is very good news. In my opinion, this does more to keep Google in check than had they gone with Firefox's engine, or stuck with their own. (I know not everyone agrees) People use Chrome because they consider it a better overall experience than other alternatives, and I happen to agree. (again, I get that not everyone here agrees with that) For whatever reason, Google has the resources and talent to make a brows…

Exactly. I hope MS will also take Android and release an MS version of it. Privacy oriented, no Google apps (that can't be removed either).

This would put more pressure on Google than privacy fines from EU. Competition works best. I'm not an MS fan (using Linux at home, with vscode), but I'll happily switch.

I wondered why MS didn't do this or partnered with Ubuntu instead of closing their Windows Phone business, fully giving up the mobile market.

Re: The new Microsoft Edge is out of preview

#247

Post by csallen »

gamblor956 wrote: post #205
ghayes wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google has for its entire history had strong ties to building a developer community. For instance Google Summer of Code [0] and here's a list of Google APIs with 179 current APIs [1]. [0] https://summerofcode.withgoogle.com/ [1] https://developers.google.com/apis-explorer

Conveniently leaving out the hundreds of times that Google has randomly terminated APIs or entire products with minimal if any forewarning, or reduced API functionality or pricing without forewarning, and the complete and utter lack of support [edit] Google provides to developers who don't already have their own twitter following.

It's almost as if Google is a massive organization running hundreds of initiatives spanning decades, making it difficult to simplify things with a single description.

Re: The new Microsoft Edge is out of preview

#248

Post by darekkay »

duxup wrote: post #232
sime2009 wrote: post #184

Regarding the topic of browser mono-cultures, I was web developer in the post browser war era in the early 2000s where we had a dominant IE6 and a stagnant browser landscape. It was bad. Real bad. But I'm actually fairly positive about MS getting into the chromium landscape and back into the game. Let's face it MS had lost all of its influence in the browser world before dropping IE and making this move. It is a Goog…

I'm a noob web dev working in a small shop that sells a niche SaaS product. We had a customer push us to support Edge. The dev team (3 dudes) just looked at eachother and laid down the "No, Firefox or Chrome...". It's just so much pressure to dance around the "this one does this, that one doesn't" and generally we rarely run into any Firefox and Chrome issues. Edge, just not worth it for a small team. I'm glad we pro…

To be fair, Edge has a good feature support (check caniuse.com). It would be interesting to know what the exact issues your app has with the browser. Otherwise it sounds more like your devs like to use some vendor-specific hacks and blame Edge for it. I know there are some Flexbox things to consider, but nothing a small team can't handle.

IE11 is another story, though.

Re: The new Microsoft Edge is out of preview

#249

Post by tsimionescu »

crazygringo wrote: post #231
altitudinous wrote: post #127

On MacOS it requires admin privilege to install. I am done with that after all the crap that previous software with admin rights installed. I cleaned it up and swore I would not install anything that required admin rights again - for my own security and peace of mind. What does it need admin rights for?

Seriously, that bugs the hell out of me too. Why do I need to give Adobe admin rights to install Photoshop? Why do I need to give Microsoft the same to install Word? And now for a web browser? If I'm installing something low-level like a window manager or a keyboard shortcut tool, I get it . But for a normal mainstream flagship consumer application, what on earth do they need admin privileges for?! I hate the fact I…

Well, there is an extremely simple reason: because these tools are installed for all users, not just your own. Doing it any other way would be wasteful on an actual multi-user machine. But some tools do support it - both Chrome and Firefox can be installed without admin privileges. There is also the fact that Office and many other products rely on demons starting at boot time, which can only be installed with admin rights. The same applies to all popular Linux distributions (even more than on Windows, since you can provide a nice current-user only installer on Windows, but any common program package on Linux requires admin rights before you can even access it).

On the other hand, for most people this admin vs regular user separation is almost meaningless and provides little extra security. Sure, if I install malware as admin it will be harder to get rid of it, but except for that, it can hurt me just as much, since all of the files I really care about (documents, photos, game saves etc) are already accessible with my user, and any program running as my user can already connect to the internet and send information about what my user is doing (not to mention bother me with ads). Some of the really damaging ransomware that recently made the rounds didn't even require admin privileges, it simply encrypted data in some common user-owned folders, if I'm not mistaken (it probably did need some privilege escalation to spread, though, which is a big problem on office networks).

Re: The new Microsoft Edge is out of preview

#250

Post by dan1234 »

duxup wrote: post #232
sime2009 wrote: post #184

Regarding the topic of browser mono-cultures, I was web developer in the post browser war era in the early 2000s where we had a dominant IE6 and a stagnant browser landscape. It was bad. Real bad. But I'm actually fairly positive about MS getting into the chromium landscape and back into the game. Let's face it MS had lost all of its influence in the browser world before dropping IE and making this move. It is a Goog…

I'm a noob web dev working in a small shop that sells a niche SaaS product. We had a customer push us to support Edge. The dev team (3 dudes) just looked at eachother and laid down the "No, Firefox or Chrome...". It's just so much pressure to dance around the "this one does this, that one doesn't" and generally we rarely run into any Firefox and Chrome issues. Edge, just not worth it for a small team. I'm glad we pro…

What are you using that Edge doesn't support?

We treat Chrome/Safari/Edge/FF all as 1st class browsers and haven't had many problems (aside from Safari lacking U2F and exotic CSS props like motion-path).

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