Live data from Hacker News

Philosopher Philip Goff answers questions about panpsychism

scientificamerican.com

1–10 of 356 posts

Re: Philosopher Philip Goff answers questions about panpsychism

#2
There's an interesting podcast where Philip Goff and Sean Carroll discuss about various aspects of panpsychism. Sean plays a very good devil's advocate, so if you enjoy a nice friendly critic of the above ideas, I highly recommend this episode!

https://www.preposterousuniverse.com/podcast/2019/11/04/71-p...

Re: Philosopher Philip Goff answers questions about panpsychism

#3
Even the theory's advocate acknowledges in this interview that it's untestable. There is no way to observe that the world would behave differently whether or not the theory is true. If that's so, I can't think what point there is discussing it, except as a mental exercise. If you can't test a theory, that means it can't affect anything. I.e. it has no practical use, except as a form of entertainment.

I would almost argue that it doesn't make sense to talk about something being true or untrue if it cannot be tested nor used to make any predictions. The whole concept of truth, for me, reflects the extent to which reality conforms to belief. So if there isn't and will never be a way to test a belief, then it's neither true nor false.

IMO, this is the type of thinking that gives philosophers a bad rap.

Re: Philosopher Philip Goff answers questions about panpsychism

#4
I think non-duality / advaita makes much more sense than panpsychism, as it requires less assumptions while remaining compatible with our experience.

Panpsychism seems like a bandaid to solve the hard problem of consciousness, which non-duality does not suffer from.

Re: Philosopher Philip Goff answers questions about panpsychism

#5

Even the theory's advocate acknowledges in this interview that it's untestable. There is no way to observe that the world would behave differently whether or not the theory is true. If that's so, I can't think what point there is discussing it, except as a mental exercise. If you can't test a theory, that means it can't affect anything. I.e. it has no practical use, except as a form of entertainment. I would almost a…

Just because the observable world is testable doesn't mean that subjectivity doesn't hold any value.

Re: Philosopher Philip Goff answers questions about panpsychism

#7

I think non-duality / advaita makes much more sense than panpsychism, as it requires less assumptions while remaining compatible with our experience. Panpsychism seems like a bandaid to solve the hard problem of consciousness, which non-duality does not suffer from.

> Panpsychism seems like a bandaid to solve the hard problem of consciousness

It doesn't even do that, it just pushes it down the stack.

If I ask, why is the sky blue, I don't want to hear "Because it's made of blue stuff."

Not only is it wrong, it doesn't have any explanatory power at all. Ultimately if you want to understand why something has a certain property, you want to know how it arises from the emergent behavior of something more fundamental. A hurricane isn't made of hurricane bits, and brains aren't made of consciousness particles.

Re: Philosopher Philip Goff answers questions about panpsychism

#8

Even the theory's advocate acknowledges in this interview that it's untestable. There is no way to observe that the world would behave differently whether or not the theory is true. If that's so, I can't think what point there is discussing it, except as a mental exercise. If you can't test a theory, that means it can't affect anything. I.e. it has no practical use, except as a form of entertainment. I would almost a…

The consciousness itself (not the theory) is in the root of what we perceive and exercising it effectively broads our perception of reality which is the single most practical thing one can do because everything else we do is limited by our perception.

Re: Philosopher Philip Goff answers questions about panpsychism

#9
Mu. The definition provided ("consciousness is experience") explains nothing, you cannot experimentally decide if atoms experience anything, the fact that they do or don't doesn't change any prediction for how they behave over time. It's meaningless, like wondering if magic exists but is actively hiding from us. Paranoia is that way.

> Despite great progress in our scientific understanding of the brain, we still don’t have even the beginnings of an explanation of how complex electrochemical signaling is somehow able to give rise to the inner subjective world of colors, sounds, smells and tastes that each of us knows in our own case. There is a deep mystery in understanding how what we know about ourselves from the inside fits together with what science tells us about matter from the outside.

We can make a very simple robot that reacts to the environment - for example follows light and learns where the walls are so as not to collide with them in the future.

It checks all the boxes that simple life does - if you say that a bacteria experience world then so does that robot. So it is conscious but we know where it comes from - it comes from the computational power and interactions with the world it can do. There's no magical spiritualism around it, it's just nested if-then-elses + memory + feedback. Which btw is as good a definition for consciousness as any other. When you become unconscious the feedback loop is interrupted.

> “Of course, you can’t do that. I designed physical science to deal with quantities, not qualities.”

"Quantity has a quality of its own". There's no qualities in the universe, just quantities and we arbitrarily assign labels (qualities) to them.

In the end I think "is X conscious" is as productive a question as "is Pluto a planet" or "can submarines swim".

Re: Philosopher Philip Goff answers questions about panpsychism

#10
Read Bernardo Kastrup's, a Dutch computer scientist and philosopher, criticism on panpsychism: "https://www.bernardokastrup.com/p/papers.html

https://iai.tv/articles/will-we-ever-understand-consciousnes... https://www.reddit.com/r/philosophy/comments/emtud2/bernardo...

He proposes an alternative answer for the mind-body problem; idealism instead of materialism https://www.bernardokastrup.com/p/papers.html

Post reply on HN