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iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

appleinsider.com

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Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#171

Post by Polylactic_acid »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #159
echelon wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Not letting you side load is a feature. No. It's not. Stop, seriously. "Not letting you vote is a feature." "Not letting you complain is a feature." "Not letting you speak is a feature." "Not letting you have free will is a feature." "Not letting you use your body as you wish is a feature." This is how we lose our digital rights. Stop buying into this utter horse shit. We have the right to repair our devices, run w…

Perhaps not allowing side loading decreases the likelihood of malware and security exploits.

Not letting you speak prevents you from saying something stupid.

Android already provides plenty of warnings and confirmations before allowing you to sideload. But in the end if you go through all of that you agree to take up the responsibility.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#172

Post by bigiain »

echelon wrote: post #110
jzvxkxbxjx wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“ If apple allowed easily sideloading apps I would consider moving over.” This was the reason I was an android guy until my wife told me to just get a phone that works. And you know what? Not letting you side load is a feature. When you see it like that, you care a lot less about your phone, and just appreciate that it works and that you can trust it as your more intimate possessions .

> Not letting you side load is a feature. No. It's not. Stop, seriously. "Not letting you vote is a feature." "Not letting you complain is a feature." "Not letting you speak is a feature." "Not letting you have free will is a feature." "Not letting you use your body as you wish is a feature." This is how we lose our digital rights. Stop buying into this utter horse shit. We have the right to repair our devices, run w…

Single data point. For me it _is_ a feature. It stops me getting sidetracked by shiny new interesting projects and installing them on my primary phone. I value that.

But being absolutist about it is just foolish.

It doesn't surprise me that a significant portion of HN readers want to use their pocket computer as a general purpose computer, capable of having anything the user chooses installed on it. I'm one of the HN readers who prefers _not_ to have that temptation (although I do have an Android phone for "playing with" and an Apple dev account and my previous few iPhones which I can run whatever code I choose).

On the other hand, my mom's "right to repair her device, run whatever code she wants on it" is a _way way_ lower priority for her than "Is reasonably safe downloading anything from the AppStore and running it, and has (arguably) industry best security and privacy while doing so".

(And comparing that iOS/Android choice to "Not letting you vote" is unhelpful hyperbole. You are likely to get taken way less seriously than you intend if you're using reality-defying comparisons like that...)

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#173

Post by nomel »

chewz wrote: post #160
jadbox wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not only do I like having the ability to limit GPS per app, but I can also disable background data and enforce 'energy saver mode' (aka make background tasks infrequent) on an individual app basis.

We can also easily mock GPS on Android and there are apps for that.

Great, you've covered 0.1% of the Android user base.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#174

Post by JoBrad »

ncallaway wrote: post #109
anarchodev wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This article is about a notification that appears on iOS devices letting you know when an app has been using your location information in the background. I haven't used Android in a while but I assume it doesn't have this. These data are often sold to advertisers, data aggregation companies, shared with police, etc. So that's the issue, more than ads being directly embedded in the apps of the phone.

> I haven't used Android in a while but I assume it doesn't have this. I've started getting these notifications on my Android device. Each app that makes a location request in the background causes a notification that allows me to take away location access from the app, only allow location access when the app is in the foreground, or always allow location access.

This notification is slightly different: you still get a notification when an app asks for permission. But later on you get a notification telling you that the app has been using a given feature x times, and you have the choice of changing the permission again. For location, it also shows a map of each location gathered by the app.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#175

Post by Polylactic_acid »

killface wrote: post #148
jzvxkxbxjx wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“ If apple allowed easily sideloading apps I would consider moving over.” This was the reason I was an android guy until my wife told me to just get a phone that works. And you know what? Not letting you side load is a feature. When you see it like that, you care a lot less about your phone, and just appreciate that it works and that you can trust it as your more intimate possessions .

It's a feature until apple makes a moral call on software. they banned all vaping-related software, but this also included apps to control folks' medical dosages of cannabis. while it was (kinda) laudible they didn't want to expose kids to smoking propaganda, I would have about 500 bucks in near-bricked devices just for switching to iOS.

Its pretty disturbing how we have a company whos products are used globally enforcing illogical American morals on the rest of the world (Apps with guns and violence are totally ok but anything with nudity is unthinkable).

Its also really bad for small business when they are forced to depend on apple for profits and literally get destroyed when apple decides their app is no longer suitable.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#176

Post by wnevets »

Waterluvian wrote: post #77

I'm probably saying the complete obvious, but Apple can completely crush Google if they execute this angle properly. Google has no choice but to support ads. They're an ad company. Apple has to keep hammering how bad the ad and privacy experiences are with Android. Make iOS an absolute delight to use in contrast. I'd pay a premium for that. Android has done a great job making me want an iOS device again, these last t…

"Google is terrible, also Google is our default search engine on safari" - Apple

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#177

Post by VRay »

Polylactic_acid wrote: post #129
jzvxkxbxjx wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re seeing it as a computer. It’s a phone.

This is the typical response I expected. "Your using it wrong!!" Explain to me why the use case of using youtube without adverts or connecting my phone to my smartwartch is invalid.

I felt the same way as you for a long time, but eventually I got too busy to keep tinkering with my Android phones.

* First I got too busy to build custom ROMs, so I switched to ClockworkMod

* Then I didn't have time to load ClockworkMod on a new phone, so I just stuck with regular Android

* Then I gradually didn't bother to keep up to speed on new, better versions of the software I was using. Over the course of a few years apps kept breaking due to SDK changes

* This whole time, Google was steadily updating the Android UX and making obnoxious changes in an attempt to beat out Apple. So the OS was getting worse and worse every year

Finally, I switched to an iPhone due to some unrelated circumstances, and I was shocked to find that I barely miss Android at all. It sucks as a computer and a cool hackable platform, but it works great as a dumb device for a few basic use cases

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#178

Post by bigiain »

Polylactic_acid wrote: post #169
bigiain wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is also true for me. It's a feature I appreciate a lot. There was a time when I actively enjoyed sysadminning and updating and securing all my personal computers. But many of "computers" are now closer to "appliances" and the last thing I want to spend time on weekends/evening these days is poking at the OS on my phone (or my book or my coffee machine or or or) I'm happy to have "let go" and chosen "I'll do thin…

You say that like a premium android phone doesn't "just work". There is nothing on android that forces you to customize things, it simply allows it.

Ahhh, no. I'm first to admit it's _me_ that's broken here.

If I can fuck with it easily, sooner or later I'll get tempted into doing so.

I appreciate having a choice that lets me force myself to say "Nope, not on the iPhone. If I want to try out $shinyThing I can do it on the older Android device, or on a spare RaspberryPi or any of the spare laptop/pcs in the workshop."

There's nothing from Apple that forces you to buy an iPhone, you're allowed to buy an Android if you choose.

Interestingly, it's _much_ harder to customise a Tesla than, say, a Mustang. I wonder which side of the "but you're taking away my rights!" argument most of the people disagreeing here fall on whether to buy a Tesla or not? (For the record, I'd like to own a Tesla and I'd happily enough "use it Elon's way", but I also like owning ~20 year old motorcycles that I can tinker with to my heart's content...)

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#180

Post by quotemstr »

ReverseCold wrote: post #16
novok wrote: post #8

The alert is annoying although for apps you want to have always on location tracking although, like some life logging apps. (Arc, etc) It's like OS doesn't want to accept there are apps you want always on location tracking on and for it to stop annoying you about it.

This might be a necessary evil. If you could turn it off (even in a convoluted way), people would do it - which is what led to the issue of such a large proportion of Americans having their location data streamed 24/7 in the first place. Unlike Windows 10 updates not giving people a choice in the matter, this only helps you, so I really don't see the problem here.

No, it does not "only help me". My attention is finite, and spurious warnings waste it. Constant unwanted nagging is paternalistic and disrespectful of the user's time.
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