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Ukrainian plane was 'unintentionally' shot down, Iran state TV says

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Re: Ukrainian plane was 'unintentionally' shot down, Iran state TV says

#141

Post by wdr1 »

cmdshiftf4 wrote: post #41

What an absolute tragedy. Well done to Iran for coming forward, admitting it and expressing their regrets over it. It's a stark cry from the utter denial others have expressed when similar accidents have happened, and astronomically further than when George H. W. Bush proclaimed "I will never apologize for the United States — I don't care what the facts are... I'm not an apologize-for-America kind of guy." when the N…

That quote you gave is awfully misleading, as Bush was not speaking about flight 655.

Ronald Reagan, the actual president at the time, did apologize a few days after the event.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1988/07/06/r...

If you really want to compare the two events, note that after ~4 hours after the event the US did acknowledge it had shot down the airline. While it did to continue to maintain it wasn't in the wrong, there's a stark difference between that & the multi-day denial of Iran.

Re: Ukrainian plane was 'unintentionally' shot down, Iran state TV says

#142

Post by Aeolun »

bigiain wrote: post #69
Aeolun wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not like throwing stones will have any effect at this point. Iran is already pretty well covered in them.

"I do not know with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones." -- Albert Einstein

Yeah. I tried to say that Iran has been sanctioned with so many measures for so long now that anything more we add won’t really make a difference, but I guess that went wrong :)

Re: Ukrainian plane was 'unintentionally' shot down, Iran state TV says

#143

Post by eloff »

boomboomsubban wrote: post #137
eloff wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, I'm aware of the incident, but that article doesn't support "and blamed it on Iran", so you have a source for that?

To this day, the official US story is that they were acting in self defense in international waters.

That's a stretch for them to claim that. More like being the aggressors in Iranian waters. Still afaik they did own up to shooting down the airliner, and did not try to blame Iran for doing that. Happy to be proven wrong.

Re: Ukrainian plane was 'unintentionally' shot down, Iran state TV says

#144

Post by boomboomsubban »

eloff wrote: post #143
boomboomsubban wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To this day, the official US story is that they were acting in self defense in international waters.

That's a stretch for them to claim that. More like being the aggressors in Iranian waters. Still afaik they did own up to shooting down the airliner, and did not try to blame Iran for doing that. Happy to be proven wrong.

The Wikipedia article you read says the US maintains that is what happened. The settlement they paid was specifically worded so that they could maintain that position. Claiming self defense is them claiming Iran was attacking them, or at least "someone" that was implied to be Iran, making Iran the one to blame.

Re: Ukrainian plane was 'unintentionally' shot down, Iran state TV says

#145

Post by tunesmith »

bufferoverflow wrote: post #113
tunesmith wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With that in mind, it's even more amazing we've avoided full-on nuclear war multiple times.

Iran doesn't have the capability to deliver their nukes. No ICBMs capable of reaching the US, they can only try to use a long range bomber plane. https://www.aljazeera.com/mritems/Images/2017/9/23/75c570944...

I meant in general, worldwide with other countries, but that is good to know.

Re: Ukrainian plane was 'unintentionally' shot down, Iran state TV says

#146

Post by boomboomsubban »

eloff wrote: post #143
boomboomsubban wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To this day, the official US story is that they were acting in self defense in international waters.

That's a stretch for them to claim that. More like being the aggressors in Iranian waters. Still afaik they did own up to shooting down the airliner, and did not try to blame Iran for doing that. Happy to be proven wrong.

Sorry to double post, but I was thinking about this. I think you assumed I meant the US blamed Iran for firing the missile that brought down the airliner, when I was saying the US said that Iran intentionally caused the accident. An understandable confusion given the connection to current events.

Even after Iran confirmed their missile was the one responsible for this crash, it was prudent to deny it until they ruled out a foreign infiltration. Stuxnet showed how far the US will go to infiltrate Iran.

Re: Ukrainian plane was 'unintentionally' shot down, Iran state TV says

#147

Post by eloff »

boomboomsubban wrote: post #146
eloff wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a stretch for them to claim that. More like being the aggressors in Iranian waters. Still afaik they did own up to shooting down the airliner, and did not try to blame Iran for doing that. Happy to be proven wrong.

Sorry to double post, but I was thinking about this. I think you assumed I meant the US blamed Iran for firing the missile that brought down the airliner, when I was saying the US said that Iran intentionally caused the accident. An understandable confusion given the connection to current events. Even after Iran confirmed their missile was the one responsible for this crash, it was prudent to deny it until they ruled…

Ah, ok thanks for clearing that up. That is exactly what I was thinking.
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