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Language Learning with Netflix extension

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Re: Language Learning with Netflix extension

#31

Post by axaxs »

sk0g wrote: post #24
silisili wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree. That said, my wife subtitles every movie which normally I don't care about, except the subtitles are -wrong-. I don't know why they do that, it seems rather innocent, but drives me crazy as an English speaker. It's usually something not even so consequential..off the top of my head like replacing 'Time for dinner' with 'Time for supper'. Not an exact example, but it's usually along these lines.

Are the shows you're watching dubbed? Was recently watching How to Sell Drugs Online (Fast), which is a German show originally, and the subtitles were off in a similar way. Drove me nuts! I ended up switching the audio language to German and watching it with English subtitles, was a miles better experience for me.

Nope, original English shows. What's frustrating is that my wife uses subtitles for learning how words are spelled, but the words spoken aren't the same as the ones written!

Re: Language Learning with Netflix extension

#32

Post by remarkEon »

hrasyid wrote: post #10

I think having subtitles in your native language can hurt learning because it tends to be easier to just follow the subtitle than actually trying to understand the target language. You can't read both at the same time. But I agree that Netflix is a great resource for learning a foreign language. I went from zero to being able to understand a normal TV show in the target language in one year, mostly by watching childr…

Just tried it out with a German show I watch. I think the issue is that the native language subtitles (English for me) can have subtly different literal translations than what might be on the screen in the original language. So while the English subtitles can convey the same meaning, the word-for-word translation is going to be off. This is fine, really, and any language learner is probably already aware of this.

Otherwise, the implementation looks great. Easy, simple to use and intuitive controls. The running list of subtitles on the right is nice. To your point about playback speed, maybe it's just me but I like the challenge of trying to keep up with the foreign language and it helps with developing my listening skills (I also really don't want to watch children's shows). I think the ability to toggle the Auto-pause more or less solves this problem, at least for me. Would still like a Firefox extension though. This will be the only instance in which I use Chrome.

Edit: Hmm reading the other comments here, maybe this is actually a problem with the translation itself? If non-native speakers are noticing instances where it's off it seems there might be a quality control issue.

Re: Language Learning with Netflix extension

#34

Post by [deleted] »

remarkEon wrote: post #32
hrasyid wrote: post #10

I think having subtitles in your native language can hurt learning because it tends to be easier to just follow the subtitle than actually trying to understand the target language. You can't read both at the same time. But I agree that Netflix is a great resource for learning a foreign language. I went from zero to being able to understand a normal TV show in the target language in one year, mostly by watching childr…

Just tried it out with a German show I watch. I think the issue is that the native language subtitles (English for me) can have subtly different literal translations than what might be on the screen in the original language. So while the English subtitles can convey the same meaning, the word-for-word translation is going to be off. This is fine, really, and any language learner is probably already aware of this. Oth…

[deleted]

Re: Language Learning with Netflix extension

#35

Post by scipio_oregonus »

remarkEon wrote: post #32
hrasyid wrote: post #10

I think having subtitles in your native language can hurt learning because it tends to be easier to just follow the subtitle than actually trying to understand the target language. You can't read both at the same time. But I agree that Netflix is a great resource for learning a foreign language. I went from zero to being able to understand a normal TV show in the target language in one year, mostly by watching childr…

Just tried it out with a German show I watch. I think the issue is that the native language subtitles (English for me) can have subtly different literal translations than what might be on the screen in the original language. So while the English subtitles can convey the same meaning, the word-for-word translation is going to be off. This is fine, really, and any language learner is probably already aware of this. Oth…

Been using this extension for a bit now. Turn on machine translations. The default translations are translating the meaning but not word by word. The machine translations are the latter. Which is way better for learning, which is why I assume it's a premium feature.

Re: Language Learning with Netflix extension

#36

Post by thecatspaw »

nitrogen wrote: post #30
skrebbel wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still can't get my head around how user hostile they made this. I mean, why? I understand showing the most likely languages on top, but why hide content that's available? I have bilingual kids (Dutch and Danish, living in NL) and the amount of setup we have to do each week to get and keep Danish audio for cartoons on Netflix is pretty nuts.

Not sure, but maybe the subtitle tracks have different licensing?

Wouldnt they need to check this based on location, and not on user interface language though?

Re: Language Learning with Netflix extension

#37

Post by SJetKaran »

nitrogen wrote: post #30
skrebbel wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still can't get my head around how user hostile they made this. I mean, why? I understand showing the most likely languages on top, but why hide content that's available? I have bilingual kids (Dutch and Danish, living in NL) and the amount of setup we have to do each week to get and keep Danish audio for cartoons on Netflix is pretty nuts.

Not sure, but maybe the subtitle tracks have different licensing?

Prime video shows all subtitles. Even if we assume it is licensing, then Netflix's own shows should show more subtitles, but they just don't. I think they see showing tons of subtitle languages being shown as an UX issue.

Re: Language Learning with Netflix extension

#38

Post by BasDirks »

cpdt wrote: post #28
silisili wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree. That said, my wife subtitles every movie which normally I don't care about, except the subtitles are -wrong-. I don't know why they do that, it seems rather innocent, but drives me crazy as an English speaker. It's usually something not even so consequential..off the top of my head like replacing 'Time for dinner' with 'Time for supper'. Not an exact example, but it's usually along these lines.

From what I've heard, when dubbing shows they normally adapt the translations for the dub to fit better with the character's mouth movements and to make it more 'idiomatic' in the target language, but the subtitles keep the literal translation. It would be interesting to learn why, I find it drives me crazy as well.

Semi-synced dubs are an early example of uncanny valley

Re: Language Learning with Netflix extension

#39

Post by imjustsaying »

In practice, the foreign subtitles do not line up with the foreign words as well as the native subtitles line up with the native words. It took me years to figure out why this was.

In a conversation I had with someone who knew the business, the new language subtitles don't line up with the new language audio because the new language subtitles are translated from the original language subtitles, not the new language audio.

Why? This saves a step from someone having to rewatch the final new language dialogue and transcribe the new language as it is exactly spoken. That step can be skipped and the new language subtitles can still be translated from the original language subtitles, although they will be quite off much of the time.

Re: Language Learning with Netflix extension

#40

Post by ta999999171 »

leokennis wrote: post #26
silisili wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree. That said, my wife subtitles every movie which normally I don't care about, except the subtitles are -wrong-. I don't know why they do that, it seems rather innocent, but drives me crazy as an English speaker. It's usually something not even so consequential..off the top of my head like replacing 'Time for dinner' with 'Time for supper'. Not an exact example, but it's usually along these lines.

It was said in a major Dutch newspaper last year that Netflix seriously underpays/over pressures the translators: https://www.nrc.nl/nieuws/2019/06/07/ondertitelaars-voelen-z... Basically in “the good old days” translating/subtitling was a serious job for serious money. But it has been turned into almost a “work from home, gig economy Mechanical Turk” thing. And the quality obviously suffers.

I won't even try the shows whose trailers have the problem stated in this thread.

It's blatantly obvious 3 seconds in. Very unprofessional.

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