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Paris syndrome

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Re: Paris syndrome

#121

Post by analCavity »

intrepidhero wrote: post #87

Hang on. Why is everyone talking about dirty Paris streets and not about the claim that unrealistic expectations can result in literal psychosis? Surely this kind of mind-body connection would suggest further investigation, inform policy on deceptive advertising, etc.

Because intense disappointment is very obviously transitory, and it would be laughable to indulge the petulant temper tantrums of impotent flakes.

Whatever this syndrome represents should be nothing compared to the break-up of a serious, long-term romantic relationship, or a particularly punishing loss that ruins a gambler.

Furthermore, it's a clear indicator that psychology and psychiatry are soft sciences with imprecise qualifiers of conditions. It's fair to push for the classification of sensations, emotions and the manner of thought formation (suicide ideation, eureka/ah-ha moments), but just because someone had unrealistic expectations for their dream vacation, which is now ruined, and must be endured for several days, doesn't mean they have a mental illness that needs intervention.

This is like one of those dubious maladies that a placebo could dispell. I like to say that Restless Leg Syndrome (RLS) is equal parts a hypochondriac's dream and a snake oil salesman's profit center. Is it real? Are the afflicted just pretenders? Actually, does it even matter?

I think the disappointment and disillusionment is real, and what a pain in the ass the rest of the vacation will be, if your stuck in a hotel room with someone like this, but their mopey, sulky attitude is just a mood.

After the 2016 election, lots of people were demonstrating a similar mood, the next morning. So, this sort of thing is a fact of life. There are winners and losers, and unforced errors.

You're going to tie this to deceptive advertising? And then what?

What else will you strap rubber baby buggy bumpers to, in order to offer emotional support for the sad people who suffered the indignity of their feet touching the ground?

Re: Paris syndrome

#122

Post by pier25 »

Paris has some iconic landmarks but other than that I find it's a very unpleasant and ugly city.

If you want to see a beautiful imperial and romantic type of city go to Vienna.

Re: Paris syndrome

#123

Post by mettamage »

intrepidhero wrote: post #87

Hang on. Why is everyone talking about dirty Paris streets and not about the claim that unrealistic expectations can result in literal psychosis? Surely this kind of mind-body connection would suggest further investigation, inform policy on deceptive advertising, etc.

IMO it's also really obscure, 20 in 6 million.

That's about 0.0000003 chance.

Isn't there a base rate? If anyone does something anything new that's as big as visiting Paris while coming from Japan, then I'd venture to guess that 1 in 6 million will get a psychiatric disorder. I mean, the chance is so low that I dare to guess that it might be the base rate.

Re: Paris syndrome

#124

Post by BryanBigs »

narag wrote: post #71
douglasmurray12 wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not all capitals - it is a question of policy. Tokyo, for instance, seems to be very different.

Interesting. So in Japan people inmigrate more uniformly? In Spain is just a matter of opportunities. It's easier to find a job in big cities.

Japan has very little immigration when compared to other countries. In 2015 ~2% of the population was from immigrants. The USA for comparison, has a 14.5% rate (+/- a few tenths, I'm pulling that from memory.)

Re: Paris syndrome

#125

Post by core-questions »

fortran77 wrote: post #108
core-questions wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Please leave your hatred for Israel out of this. Israel is extremely multicultural. All signs are officially in three languages. The population is 20% Arabic, and 60% of the Jews there come from all over the middle east and Africa.

Please leave your artificial, unfounded judgement calls about "hatred for Israel" out of this. I do not hate Israel, I just recognize it as an ethnic state that is for and by the Israeli people; while others may live there, it is clear from reading any major publication from the region that it is a regieme that operates in its own interests.

I have no issue with that. In fact, I like it so much I'd like to adopt the idea.

Re: Paris syndrome

#126

Post by core-questions »

claudiawerner wrote: post #95
douglasmurray12 wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is not racism or xenophobia to want to preserve what is good about a nation's culture, and limit the import of other nations' and culture's problems. Could you please answer the following questions: 1. Is there a limit at which you believe mass migration into France would be undesirable? 2. If you believe that there is such a limit; what would a legitimate movement to argue for limiting mass migration look like, s…

>1. Is there a limit at which you believe mass migration into France would be undesirable? Too much mass immigration to anywhere would be undesirable, but for economic and population density reasons. I am skeptical of the idea of the idea that culture is fixed and immutable. > what would a legitimate movement to argue for limiting mass migration look like It would exist in a time where mass immigration is causing the…

> Too much mass immigration to anywhere would be undesirable, but for economic and population density reasons.

This seems like a very... austere, perhaps even autistic lens to use on the problem. It sounds like if we were just able to pack people in as perfectly as possible, like apples in a box, and somehow still maintain an average tax profitability from them, you'd be okay with whatever was happening inside the apple box.

Clearly that's a mis-characterization of you or any other reasonable person's viewpoint. The welfare of individuals, their life experience, their safety, their freedom, their ability to express themselves and find their niche... all of this matters.

> I am skeptical of the idea of the idea that culture is fixed and immutable.

Of course not. However, it moves slowly! There's a viscosity to it, and part of that resistance to change is something like an implicit Chesterton's Fence:

> Chesterton's fence is the principle that reforms should not be made until the reasoning behind the existing state of affairs is understood.

Just because you _can_ change a culture (in this case by force, by changing the cultural makeup of a region, often by fiat) does not mean that it is a moral act, or that the result you get out the other side is some predictable good. It is too complicated, too reactionary, too slippery of a concept to deal with in any way other than the purely speculative. Trends don't always continue - and conversely, pretending a trend or other demographic factor doesn't exist can be just as bad. There are far too many inconvenient truths to learn that illustrate the fallibility of humanity in every form, _particularly_ in terms of how we collectively get along with one another.

> It would exist in a time where mass immigration is causing the problems I mentioned above.

A compelling argument that this is already the case is being made by many. The solution thus far has been to remove them from the public square so we can go on pretending there are no problems.

Re: Paris syndrome

#127

Post by yaacov »

mechnesium wrote: post #46
ivanbakel wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The OP is probably being down voted for the racist dogwhistle in their comment.

I’m guessing that you didn’t read the Wikipedia article. Here’s the direct quote pertaining to appearance. “Renoux indicates that Japanese media, magazines in particular, often depict Paris as a place where most people on the street look like "stick-thin" models and most women dress in high fashion brands such as Louis Vuitton.” Your personal biases made you assume the previous commenter strictly implied race/color.

> and i’m not talking about size

Was what OP said, so I think it’s reasonable to assume they weren’t talking about size.

Re: Paris syndrome

#128

Post by credit_guy »

newshorts wrote: post #90

Very interesting, I had the opposite effect. I grew up in a very “red” part of the US and was given a very negative view of the French (or anyone else for that matter). I was so surprised to find the people were friendly, kind and inviting. A small French restaurant even stayed open late because my friend and I had just arrived in Paris and had no idea of where to find food. The city struck me as beautiful. Everythin…

I somehow had the opposite effect too. I grew up in Eastern Europe, and people told me Paris is beautiful, but not necessarily more beautiful than, say New York City, or other western big cities. Well, once I visited Paris, I loved it so much, that I can't find any other city that compares with it.

Re: Paris syndrome

#129

Post by Mountain_Skies »

fortran77 wrote: post #108
core-questions wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Please leave your hatred for Israel out of this. Israel is extremely multicultural. All signs are officially in three languages. The population is 20% Arabic, and 60% of the Jews there come from all over the middle east and Africa.

Israel didn't seem very welcoming of multiculturalism when they tricked Ethiopian Jewish women into being sterilized in order to keep their numbers down. Apparently some cultures in Israeli multiculturalism are more equal than others.

Re: Paris syndrome

#130

Post by cma »

leftyted wrote: post #58
ivanbakel wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a slightly ridiculous position if it is taken genuinely - just look at the other comments in this thread complaining about "melting pots" and "cultural erasure". More to the point - dogwhistles are meant to give subtexts with plausible deniability. That you can find an alternative meaning for them is precisely their intent. It is not a compelling argument to claim that the original commenter was, in fact, inn…

I have a fantasy of Paris as a city of beautiful, elegant people, effortlessly fashionable who walk from outdoor cafe to outdoor cafe where they order espresso and croissants while carrying baguettes under their arms. So when I read the original comment, that (admittedly childish) impression came to mind. The fact that other people immediate jumped to "melting pots" and "cultural erasure" doesn't indicate that that's…

> I have a fantasy of Paris as a city of beautiful, elegant people, effortlessly fashionable who walk from outdoor cafe to outdoor cafe where they order espresso and croissants while carrying baguettes under their arms. So when I read the original comment, that (admittedly childish) impression came to mind.

The linked article says:

> Renoux indicates that Japanese media, magazines in particular, often depict Paris as a place where most people on the street look like "stick-thin" models and most women dress in high fashion brands such as Louis Vuitton.

So when OP said he wasn’t talking about size, presumably in reference to that, I read it as a dog whistle too. Especially given the whole “great replacement” conspiracy out there and Trump’s “Paris isn’t Paris anymore.” The whole point of a dog whistle is plausible deniability though, so who knows for sure.

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