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U.S. alcohol-related deaths have doubled, study says

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Re: U.S. alcohol-related deaths have doubled, study says

#171

Post by bitexploder »

serf wrote: post #163
bradlys wrote: post #122

My father is an alcoholic. (in his case, he went to rehab and doesn't drink much anymore but he is still an alcoholic) I used to think that I was going to drink at one point. I remember thinking, "if I was of age I'd like to buy that lady a drink." But by the time I turned of age and could, I decided I wouldn't touch it. I'd never really been offered alcohol growing up - so maybe that helped settle in the habit. But,…

>I have amazing executive control (I have suffered incredible emotional and physical pain over the last decade but I have never shed a tear in that time. not to offend, but that doesn't define executive control to me. Generally it's not unhealthy to cry during emotionally turbulent episodes in your life; it's (crying) a method by which you're controlling your stress. Those i've met that don't cry tend to have longer…

My mother is an alcoholic, so I can offer some perspective, perhaps. It is a disease. I can tell for sure I have the same addictive tendencies, I have just had much better success aiming it at healthier outlets. It is fine for the alcohol to exist, plenty of people drink it socially, but it is a drug where very little good comes from it. It has limited medicinal use and significant long term impact like many recreational drugs. When you grow up seeing a parent either under it, it is very easy to be resentful at them and the alcohol. It isn’t crazy to just wish the stuff never existed. Maybe they would never have taken that first drink that set them on that path. At some point early in the process of alcoholism there is definitely an element of choice. If you catch it too late it becomes a full blown disease where the agency of the person with it is significantly reduced. They often need outside help to quit. Some common things in life truly are better just being avoided. So, I get the grandparent poster. It is armor to protect against the highly negative outcome of alcohol and alcoholism.

Re: U.S. alcohol-related deaths have doubled, study says

#172

Post by allovernow »

serf wrote: post #163
bradlys wrote: post #122

My father is an alcoholic. (in his case, he went to rehab and doesn't drink much anymore but he is still an alcoholic) I used to think that I was going to drink at one point. I remember thinking, "if I was of age I'd like to buy that lady a drink." But by the time I turned of age and could, I decided I wouldn't touch it. I'd never really been offered alcohol growing up - so maybe that helped settle in the habit. But,…

>I have amazing executive control (I have suffered incredible emotional and physical pain over the last decade but I have never shed a tear in that time. not to offend, but that doesn't define executive control to me. Generally it's not unhealthy to cry during emotionally turbulent episodes in your life; it's (crying) a method by which you're controlling your stress. Those i've met that don't cry tend to have longer…

>Generally it's not unhealthy to cry during emotionally turbulent episodes in your life; it's (crying) a method by which you're controlling your stress

This is modern pseudoscientific nonsense, born in part of institutional crises in academia.

>Those i've met that don't cry tend to have longer periods between emotional 'episodes', but tend to act out much more aggressively.

This is blatant projection of personal bias.

Some people, men in particular, deal with emotions stoically. It's a perfectly valid approach, eastern philosophy has been teaching meditation to a similar end for thousands of years, not to mention this particular gender norm existed until very recent time, while we built civilization.

I challenge you to cite a reproducible, unbiased study that rigorously demonstrates the necessity of crying for all, or at least a sizable majority of, people. The trouble is you're dealing with the softest of sciences, one which is particularly vulnerable to bias from institutional dogma.

Re: U.S. alcohol-related deaths have doubled, study says

#173

Post by rs23296008n1 »

All these addictions look very similar when you dig into the common points of each. I'd recommend Johann Hari's exploration into addiction / depression. He describes the root causes/commonalities in very accessible ways.

Helped me understand what is happening in myself and others. A lot of what we treat as normal begins to have an addictive element to it when taken even slightly too far. Social isolation isn't good for you and it causes ripple on effects. That's just one cause of addiction. Most of us have many factors simultaneously. This doesn't imply you're now an addict but the tendency is in place.

Re: U.S. alcohol-related deaths have doubled, study says

#174

Post by likemybooze »

vasilipupkin wrote: post #168
likemybooze wrote: post #158

It seems very difficult to get reliable information about what constitutes problem drinking. I think the best answer might be “if it’s interfering with your life in ways that bother you, you have a problem.” I am what my doctor would term a “heavy drinker” since I probably average 20 units (10g by weight) per week. That’s two cocktails, or half a bottle of wine, or three beers, every night. I would say maybe once eve…

there is pretty strong evidence that moderate drinking is beneficial, It isn't just one study, it's multiple studies done over many years in multiple countries. https://www.insider.com/drinking-health-benefits-heart-nutri...

Have you read the studies or the ones that disagree?

It’s been a few years now but I have. Time and time again the conclusion seems to be that the studies that say drinking is beneficial are screwing something up, eg the result is based on including very sick people who don’t drink because of their poor health, and these people die younger (and thus skew the results toward making it look like drinking increases longevity).

The studies that correct for this and other issues generally either conclude zero alcohol is best, or in one case I recall a study that concluded 5g (in other words a third of a shot, a third of a beer, or third of a glass of wine) had a minimal positive impact and by the time you got to 10g it was neutral and anything beyond 10g started reducing lifespan.

Sorry I don’t have any references. I looked into this in detail a while back and didn’t save any of what I found.

Re: U.S. alcohol-related deaths have doubled, study says

#175

Post by BoorishBears »

hooande wrote: post #162
unstatusthequo wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m not surprised at all. Why cause yourself trouble by airing dirty laundry? Zero upside for him to do so, and really no reason to. Knowing he is X person doesn’t add anything to the message, it would almost certainly have blowback for him.

what's the blowback that you envision? maybe one of his investors will say "you used to be an alcoholic so we're pulling funding"?

Yes?

Re: U.S. alcohol-related deaths have doubled, study says

#176

Post by tunesmith »

allovernow wrote: post #172
serf wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I have amazing executive control (I have suffered incredible emotional and physical pain over the last decade but I have never shed a tear in that time. not to offend, but that doesn't define executive control to me. Generally it's not unhealthy to cry during emotionally turbulent episodes in your life; it's (crying) a method by which you're controlling your stress. Those i've met that don't cry tend to have longer…

>Generally it's not unhealthy to cry during emotionally turbulent episodes in your life; it's (crying) a method by which you're controlling your stress This is modern pseudoscientific nonsense, born in part of institutional crises in academia. >Those i've met that don't cry tend to have longer periods between emotional 'episodes', but tend to act out much more aggressively. This is blatant projection of personal bias…

I don't think you need studies. Look at who crying hurts, and who crying helps. Crying alone is fairly costless, what are you wasting, time? What's the harm? But it's easy to find anecdata of how crying helps - stress relief, greater self-compassion, and the realizations that come afterwards.

Re: U.S. alcohol-related deaths have doubled, study says

#177

Post by vasilipupkin »

likemybooze wrote: post #174
vasilipupkin wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

there is pretty strong evidence that moderate drinking is beneficial, It isn't just one study, it's multiple studies done over many years in multiple countries. https://www.insider.com/drinking-health-benefits-heart-nutri...

Have you read the studies or the ones that disagree? It’s been a few years now but I have. Time and time again the conclusion seems to be that the studies that say drinking is beneficial are screwing something up, eg the result is based on including very sick people who don’t drink because of their poor health, and these people die younger (and thus skew the results toward making it look like drinking increases longe…

Doubtful that this is a valid objection. On the flip side, you would have to also exclude people who drink and drive because they skew mortality stats in ways that are not applicable to those who drink but don’t drive. Also, studies on benefits are not just about pure correlation with longevity but various beneficial effects.

Re: U.S. alcohol-related deaths have doubled, study says

#178

Post by qaq »

RaceWon wrote: post #123
wjossey wrote: post #5

My father died in July of 2015 from alcohol, at the very young age of 60. He drank daily, and then slowly stopped moving due to other health issues related to back pain. After refusing rehab and other options, he eventually died at his home one evening. His drinking buddy was my step-mother, who followed an identical trajectory. Less than four years later, she died in the same spot of the house, in her late 50s. The…

> My father died in July of 2015 from alcohol My adoptive father also died of alcohol abuse. I am Much older than you are though. He served in WWII, also most of his friends drank heavily--I suspect it was due to combat war related PTSD; but that is merely a guess. I am very careful about how much I drink, and I do have an addictive personality. I just had a talk, tonight in fact, with my 20 year old about drugs--and…

Not suggesting one does it but coke unlike alcohol causes only psychological addiction.

Re: U.S. alcohol-related deaths have doubled, study says

#179

Post by self_awareness »

I'd be happy if alcohol would be classified the same way as drugs. Because that's what it is -- narcotics. But it has so big social allowance that probably it will never happen.

From strange reason alcohol is very different than drugs, it's freely available in shops, yet we all know at least 1 person that is an alcoholic or lots of us have at least 1 alcoholic person in the family.

Re: U.S. alcohol-related deaths have doubled, study says

#180

Post by bigwavedave »

AAanon wrote: post #40
WhompingWindows wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How religious is AA?

If I had to give you a number, 20% (with a church being 100%)? But it really depends on the group. There non-religious modifications to the AA program. They don't say a prayer every 3 minutes. It definitely worth going to a meeting or two just to listen to their stories.

My brother goes to one in Utah where they're actually very careful to stay away from any religious aspects. They understand that not everyone in Utah is LDS and they're very careful to make it so everyone feels included and isn't turned off by any religious undertones. I went with him to support him for his very first meeting and it was surprising how strict this rule was.
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