Lime shuts in 12 markets, lays off around 100 • Hacker News Board

Re: Lime shuts in 12 markets, lays off around 100

#71

Post by themagician » Thu, Jan 09, 2020, 7:14 PM UTC

bransonf wrote: post #42

Does anyone actually think this is a profitable market? Electric scooters are expensive, repair and charging is expensive. It’s a seasonal business. Vandalism/abuse is fairly common. In terms of any environmental benefit, I highly suspect more gasoline is being consumed to collect and distribute scooters than the offset of a few last mile transports. I suspect the cost to the consumer would have to double for it to m…

They saw what happened with bike share.

The exit strategy was always: get acquired by Ford, GM, or another major auto manufacturer who wants the ad space. OR look to companies with massive ad spend: Citibank, Wells Fargo, BNP Paribas, Oracle, etc. that would love to have ads in places where ads aren’t allowed (eg. parks) through this loophole.

The scooters are just branded litter, which is a huge market. As long as they can claim it serves some other purpose, it’s legal. You could start dumping branded water fountains all over cities saying it has something to do with hydration and it would be allowed as long as there was an app that allowed you to donate in bitcoin.

Re: Lime shuts in 12 markets, lays off around 100

#72

Post by jMyles » Thu, Jan 09, 2020, 7:14 PM UTC

I wonder how many startup scooters have been thrown away. Have we filled a stadium yet?

Will there someday be a museum located at a landfill which is full of these things?

I generally think that this kind of final mile solution is a good one, but I can't help but feel like a lot of these scooters are experiencing very short service lives.

Re: Lime shuts in 12 markets, lays off around 100

#73

Post by ravenstine » Thu, Jan 09, 2020, 7:14 PM UTC

jeffnappi wrote: post #21

Lime has the worst bikes on the planet - they are complete garbage compared to the Uber/JUMP bikes (and probably others). The Lime bikes seemed to constantly be falling apart and were actually pretty terrifying to ride. On the other hand, the JUMP bikes feel very robust and I feel safe riding them. I would rather walk half a mile to find a JUMP bike than ride a Lime bike. No wonder they are failing. Source: Rode both…

I didn't even realize they still had bikes.

In my town, they rolled out the Lime bikes and then pulled out a year and a half later. Now there are a bunch of abandoned green squares around the neighborhood where they used to be deployed.

Re: Lime shuts in 12 markets, lays off around 100

#74

Post by cpitman » Thu, Jan 09, 2020, 7:15 PM UTC

bosie wrote: post #6

vkou wrote: post #4

Is this because you can't make money off short-term scooter rentals (Because the cost of providing this service is > what customers are willing to pay), or because other startups ate their lunch? My wife is seriously considering a scooter (Even a non-electrified one) for her commute (2-3 days a week, 5 miles) - and I can't see a world where we'd rent one on the daily, as opposed to owning. My uninformed guess is: A p…

5 miles one way? Genuine question but why would you want to commute 5 miles on a scooter multiple times a week compared to a bicycle?

Another advantage is that scooters place less restrictions on how you are dressed. Dresses, shoes not meant for exercise, etc.

Re: Lime shuts in 12 markets, lays off around 100

#75

Post by jeffnappi » Thu, Jan 09, 2020, 7:15 PM UTC

jeppebemad wrote: post #34

jeffnappi wrote: post #21

Lime has the worst bikes on the planet - they are complete garbage compared to the Uber/JUMP bikes (and probably others). The Lime bikes seemed to constantly be falling apart and were actually pretty terrifying to ride. On the other hand, the JUMP bikes feel very robust and I feel safe riding them. I would rather walk half a mile to find a JUMP bike than ride a Lime bike. No wonder they are failing. Source: Rode both…

In copenhagen Lime is the most robust (and albeit clunky) of the 5-6 brands present. It seems they are the same as in your town. Wonder why our experience differ so much?

Maybe because Americans treat the bikes poorly compared to the civilized folks of Denmark ;)

The JUMP bikes are just better made by a wide margin and seem to handle the abuse well - https://www.standard.co.uk/tech/london-electric-bikes-tested...

Re: Lime shuts in 12 markets, lays off around 100

#76

Post by jeffnappi » Thu, Jan 09, 2020, 7:16 PM UTC

Wheaties466 wrote: post #56

jeffnappi wrote: post #21

Lime has the worst bikes on the planet - they are complete garbage compared to the Uber/JUMP bikes (and probably others). The Lime bikes seemed to constantly be falling apart and were actually pretty terrifying to ride. On the other hand, the JUMP bikes feel very robust and I feel safe riding them. I would rather walk half a mile to find a JUMP bike than ride a Lime bike. No wonder they are failing. Source: Rode both…

I actually really like the lime bikes. In my city lime is the only option with the E-assist and I see people riding them all the time.

If the only option with e-assist was Lime I can see why you'd like them :) However if you have JUMP available it's no contest - https://www.standard.co.uk/tech/london-electric-bikes-tested...

Re: Lime shuts in 12 markets, lays off around 100

#77

Post by romwell » Thu, Jan 09, 2020, 7:17 PM UTC

wufufufu wrote: post #66

bransonf wrote: post #42

Does anyone actually think this is a profitable market? Electric scooters are expensive, repair and charging is expensive. It’s a seasonal business. Vandalism/abuse is fairly common. In terms of any environmental benefit, I highly suspect more gasoline is being consumed to collect and distribute scooters than the offset of a few last mile transports. I suspect the cost to the consumer would have to double for it to m…

> Electric scooters are expensive, repair and charging is expensive Citation needed, at least to convince me. I think they could significantly bring down the cost at scale (production/maintenance wise at least).

>Citation needed

Here's one supporting piece of evidence:

>Lime shuts in 12 markets, lays off around 100

Re: Lime shuts in 12 markets, lays off around 100

#78

Post by Symbiote » Thu, Jan 09, 2020, 7:18 PM UTC

jeppebemad wrote: post #34

jeffnappi wrote: post #21

Lime has the worst bikes on the planet - they are complete garbage compared to the Uber/JUMP bikes (and probably others). The Lime bikes seemed to constantly be falling apart and were actually pretty terrifying to ride. On the other hand, the JUMP bikes feel very robust and I feel safe riding them. I would rather walk half a mile to find a JUMP bike than ride a Lime bike. No wonder they are failing. Source: Rode both…

In copenhagen Lime is the most robust (and albeit clunky) of the 5-6 brands present. It seems they are the same as in your town. Wonder why our experience differ so much?

GP has used Lime e-bicycles, but you've used Lime scooters.

Example Lime e-bicycle: https://road.cc/content/news/252967-london-gets-its-first-do...

Re: Lime shuts in 12 markets, lays off around 100

#79

Post by jressey » Thu, Jan 09, 2020, 7:18 PM UTC

bransonf wrote: post #42

Does anyone actually think this is a profitable market? Electric scooters are expensive, repair and charging is expensive. It’s a seasonal business. Vandalism/abuse is fairly common. In terms of any environmental benefit, I highly suspect more gasoline is being consumed to collect and distribute scooters than the offset of a few last mile transports. I suspect the cost to the consumer would have to double for it to m…

I don't think anybody thought it was a guaranteed win, but it was cheap enough to enter that a bunch of VCs went in for it.

Re: Lime shuts in 12 markets, lays off around 100

#80

Post by jeffnappi » Thu, Jan 09, 2020, 7:19 PM UTC

bransonf wrote: post #42

Does anyone actually think this is a profitable market? Electric scooters are expensive, repair and charging is expensive. It’s a seasonal business. Vandalism/abuse is fairly common. In terms of any environmental benefit, I highly suspect more gasoline is being consumed to collect and distribute scooters than the offset of a few last mile transports. I suspect the cost to the consumer would have to double for it to m…

I think e-bikes in certain markets will be profitable as a division of bigger organizations like Uber/Lyft. For example I spent $6 on two JUMP bike rentals last night to get to and from a Meetup. It was convenient and the bikes did the job handily. As a company that only does the bike share, I don't think they will be able to compete with the likes of Uber/Lyft etc.