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Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers

latimes.com

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Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers

#261

Post by unapologetic »

umvi wrote: post #51
blululu wrote: post #49

There are plenty of examples where unions can be a constructive force in securing good working conditions while promoting good business practices. Given the poor reputation of video game development work this could be a really positive development. That being said, the last time I had a unionized job I was pretty disappointed with the results. They consistently failed to secure cost of living adjustments, and the one…

USA has a pretty bad track record when it comes to unions. In theory they are great, but in practice they get implemented really poorly. I think we need to examine how other countries do unions because I agree, the one union I was in for a short time (teachers' union in California - I was basically forced to join even though the job was only temporary) felt like a ball and chain around my ankle taking a cut of my pay…

The US had a fine track record until they started pushing anti-union propaganda, started having union corruption and corresponding aggressive police crackdowns, and the government abandoned the working class. Now Michigan is a right to work state and free trade has killed thousands of domestic manufacturing jobs.

Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers

#262

Post by Kalium »

Symbiote wrote: post #250
legitster wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a relative who is a Teamster and pays $16k in Union dues a year. He said the math on his benefits only works out for him if he works for more than 15 years in the same position. Obviously different for different unions, but the vast majority of benefits in most unions go to those with seniority.

What!? That is over 60× the membership cost of UNITE (the largest British union). Apparently, comparisons between the US and Europe don't work here either. Maybe this is because "union shops" are allowed in the USA. Article 11 of the European Convention on Human Rights forbids them (the right to free association is taken to provide the right not to associate). https://unitetheunion.org/why-join/join-unite/contributio…

UAW dues apparently run $70 per month - https://www.labornotes.org/blogs/2013/12/uaw-dues-increase-b...

Which is still over three times the top rate at UNITE.

I don't know what an average US union's dues are though.

Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers

#263

Post by theFeller00 »

bob1029 wrote: post #5

I read all of this as "Major union seeks to extract rent from an additional sector". I agree that putting developers on death marches is antithetical to everything that is human, but it's not like you don't have options in this industry... Tech work isn't like coal mining where your health is legitimately at risk on a daily basis, and where the number of alternative options available to the average worker is low to n…

I don't feel like I have any options. I've felt burned out for about four years now. Our tech stack is very old and my my interest in programming is near zero at this point. I feel like I'm just waiting out the inevitable. I don't live in SV or an area with more than a handful of companies who would provide a desirable job.

Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers

#264

Post by unapologetic »

crdoconnor wrote: post #67
umvi wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

USA has a pretty bad track record when it comes to unions. In theory they are great, but in practice they get implemented really poorly. I think we need to examine how other countries do unions because I agree, the one union I was in for a short time (teachers' union in California - I was basically forced to join even though the job was only temporary) felt like a ball and chain around my ankle taking a cut of my pay…

Employers tend to be a lot more hostile to unions in the US. This manifests with deliberately spread FUD about unions (e.g. the ridiculous Walmart video), covert attempts to sabotage, depiction of schoolteachers as terrorists (by the Kentucky governor) and, in one rather extreme case, aerial bombardment of striking workers.

Why is this grayed out?

Wrongthink?

Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers

#265

Post by jahaja »

username90 wrote: post #210
jahaja wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Implementing a union will benefit few but the union leaders. What the heck? This sounds like something out of a movie. Do you think union leaders get a cut of every member's pay or something?

> Do you think union leaders get a cut of every member's pay or something? Isn't this exactly what happens? You pay the union a percentage of your salary, which is then used to among other things pay union leaders salaries. And just to note, union leaders typically earn a lot more than union members, making this transaction regressive in nature.

Wow, this is a very cynical interpretation of union leaders salaries. The previous posts implies that they are enriching themselves through members dues in a caricature manner.

Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers

#266

Post by lawnchair_larry »

eropple wrote: post #43
lawnchair_larry wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This seems like an argument against unions. I certainly don’t want to live in a world where somebody is guaranteed a wage or a job due to age or seniority. This just seems really entitled. It’s up to you to create value, regardless of age.

Mm. I sure do love to create value . That's certainly why I live. Not to, like, experience the world, or to do things I care about. Nope! I live to create value . Work to live, not live to work. Well-run unions help workers do that, both young and old.

What you do or don’t love is not relevant. You’re free to provide me with no value at all if you choose. But I’m obviously not going to give you any of my money in that case.

If you want someone to give you money so that you can do things like experience the world, or eat, you have to provide something in return.

You don’t get something for nothing.

Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers

#267

Post by quotemstr »

adamsea wrote: post #21
Aaronstotle wrote: post #9

I can't really see tech workers joining a union, game industry makes more sense as it's notoriously terrible and there's nothing but horror stories about the working conditions.

People in the game industry are tech workers.

Software has eaten the world. There are tech workers in every sector. It's getting to the point that the phrase "tech company" isn't really meaningful.

Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers

#268

Post by jahaja »

dragonwriter wrote: post #229
jahaja wrote: post #131

How Americans can be so anti-union by default is really beyond me when looking at the facts at the ground: * A culture of overwork (especially in the game industry). * No vacation. * No parental leave. * No sick leave. * At-will-employment (which inherently causes massive under-reporting of things like sexual harassment in the workplace due to the fear of losing ones livelihood, and please spare me the "actually it's…

The US has federally mandated (job-protected, but not necessarily paid) parental leave, and a number of states have mandated paid parental and sick leave. Of course, these are largely a product of lobbying by unions, which don't just do collective bargaining.

"Under the FMLA, most new parents can take up to 12 weeks of unpaid leave without the threat of job loss. That’s most parents, not all parents. Employees qualify for leave under the FMLA when they’ve worked 1,240 hours over 12 months at a company that employs more than 50 people. With part-time workers and small business employees left in the lurch, only about 60 percent of American workers are entitled to leave under the FMLA.

The FMLA does not require your employer to pay you while you’re home with your kid. So even if you’re legally entitled to take leave, you might not be able to afford it."

This is still very very poor.

Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers

#269

Post by trianglem »

hpoe wrote: post #97
Tiktaalik wrote: post #54

I would strongly consider supporting a video game union, if only to help formalize the things that the good shops do and bring those practices industry wide. Personally I haven't done a day of overtime in seven years and I feel reasonably compensated but there are clearly other places out there that are still exploiting their workers. Improving worker input into production schedules and creating clear guidelines arou…

> creating more opportunities for young new grads to break in Just going to point out, everywhere, I have ever heard of a union it generally made it harder for new people to come in, not easier, by increasing the commitment an employer is expected to make to an employee, and by making it harder to remove employees that need to be removed but can't because of their seniority with the union.

Not true, afaik unions make it easier to get the job initially if you have the right education/credentials

Re: Major union launches campaign to organize video game and tech workers

#270

Post by subtlpropaganda »

forrestthewoods wrote: post #222
tomtheelder wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We live at the absolute _extreme_ of capital power over labor power. Unions can certainly do harm, and you are right that they shouldn't be seen as a pure and irreproachable force for good, but small anecdotes about individual bad decisions made by unions are not useful in discussions about this. In fact, they play to the already ridiculously anti-union sentiment that the vast majority of Americans (this article is a…

> We live at the absolute _extreme_ of capital power over labor power. The #1 problem in most cities is too many people are making too much money and it’s driving housing prices through the roof. The demand for skilled labor is astronomical. I would not call that absolute extreme power of capital over labor.

Urban housing scarcity is mainly caused by speculation and corrupt zoning laws.
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