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For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity

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Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity

#311

Post by TeMPOraL »

smabie wrote: post #167
hcarvalhoalves wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not long ago, it seems companies were still in the business of making tractors, or cars, or cakes, or something... Nowadays it seems every company is in the business of making money and paying bonuses for directors. The rest is an excuse.

The teleological purpose of a company is to make money. Also, what time period are you talking about, exactly?

Perhaps at the time people did not accept this concept? I mean, if people don't see a problem with switching terminal values (feeding people) and instrumental values (making money) around, then there's no hope for humanity anymore.

Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity

#312

Post by stjohnswarts »

Someone1234 wrote: post #154
gen220 wrote: post #147

We recently had to bin a beloved TV, and were looking for a "simple" 4k TV (i.e. not a smart TV ) to replace it, and were surprised to find that they simply don't exist! We ended up uncovering a 6 year old 1080p TV that was still in the box at Best Buy. All in all, this problem might present an opportunity -- there might be new markets for these types of devices (dumb TVs, tractors, refrigerators, air conditioners, t…

Just don't hook the "smart TV" up to the internet. Then you have a dumb TV.

Exactly, it can't phone home so you essentially have lobotomized the smart part.

Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity

#313

Post by rascul »

quacked wrote: post #220
earlINmeyerkeg wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are dairy co-ops where I live that do this sort of thing. That's why they're so huge. However the small ma and pop ones that have local well known businesses charge an arm and a leg for half a gallon of milk. Yeah sorry, I'll pay half that cost for a gallon at walmart, thanks.

Your choice unfortunately affects the greater world. Which would you rather have- a locally-produced society that's expensive to live in, or a Walmart society that's convenient to live in?

Around here, there's a chain of grocery stores that costs less than Walmart for better quality, locally sourced dairy (not milk though), meat, fruits, and vegetables. Boxed goods are usually cheaper at Walmart, though.

Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity

#314

Post by ken »

macinjosh wrote: post #98

My grandfather, rest his soul, was a 3rd generation rancher and farmer. He bought 2 John Deere tractors in the '80s and used them for 35 years. They are still being used to this day on the ranch. Growing up, I visited the ranch regularly. Farming and ranching is very hard on equipment so the tractors often needed repair. My father and grandfather could seemingly fix anything on the tractor without even needing to go…

It sounds like the "pets / cattle" metaphor is finally returning to actual ranches.

I don't think software is eating the whole world but it's eating that one. That tells me it's ripe for disruption.

Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity

#315

Post by dsfyu404ed »

quacked wrote: post #220
earlINmeyerkeg wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are dairy co-ops where I live that do this sort of thing. That's why they're so huge. However the small ma and pop ones that have local well known businesses charge an arm and a leg for half a gallon of milk. Yeah sorry, I'll pay half that cost for a gallon at walmart, thanks.

Your choice unfortunately affects the greater world. Which would you rather have- a locally-produced society that's expensive to live in, or a Walmart society that's convenient to live in?

I'd rather have milk be readily available at $2.19 USD/gal than subsidize local farms.

I make six figures and I can get by at $4/gal but if/when you apply that reasoning to subsidies/protectionist regulations across the economy my ability to purchase goods and services is greatly reduced and so is my quality of life. I'd get by though. But it's not about me. It's about the family making half of what I make with three children that need to be fed and clothed. They're the ones who really get screwed when you hike the prices of commodities with protectionist measures. So given the choice of who gets screwed I'd pick the local dairy farmers every time.

Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity

#316

Post by DickingAround »

deogeo wrote: post #233
WaylonKenning wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This could be a business opportunity for another tractor manufacturer. You're not forced to buy a John Deere. Boutique tractors, hand repairable, simple parts. If people are hoarding onto 40 year old tractors, then that's a market signal that people want those type of tractors.

Yes, lets keep hoping the Market will solve everything, and that somehow, the trend of consolidation will magically reverse itself on its own, despite how ever fewer companies control each market. Wouldn't want to realize people have more power than just what they buy.

The power to walk away and not buy is an almost ultimate power; and companies/everyone does respond aggressively to it.

It is extreme hubris to think you can use some other power to get consumers a product that they magically want more than the one they're going to choose to spend their own money on. People value their money; they'll try and get the best value they can for it.

Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity

#317

Post by velosol »

kbrackbill wrote: post #204
asdff wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's definitely intentional. You pop the hood of a new car and you see a plastic cover, not the engine. The plastic cover doesn't do anything for the car, it adds cost to the car, and mechanics have to remove and reinstall it if they do any work at all. However, it does have a function: to obscure you from the workings of your car, and push you to take the car to a dealership or someone buying genuine parts at least.

If it truly does nothing, why would the mechanic replace it instead of just leaving it off? Genuine question, I know nothing about this. Do the manufacturers at least have some explanation for why it's there other than to make access more difficult?

There's often some noise reduction (the plastic may be backed in foam) to quiet down the direct injectors on modern cars. There's also an element of less weather-proofing required for the connectors underneath the plastic (or at least easier to undo/replace).

It's also certainly about aesthetics when the car is being sold new - you open the hood and knowing nothing about cars (or modern cars) you see lots of little piece and become concerned that there's lots of things that could break. You open a car that says "$BRAND" in a $30 piece of plastic and you think, "Nice, this is a simple, reliable, easy-to-maintain vehicle!" There may be some small effect from highlighting the typical user service ports as well (windshield washer fluid, oil, brake, coolant reservoirs).

Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity

#318

Post by lotsofpulp »

nas wrote: post #203

As someone who grew up on a farm and spent 7 years running one (few thousand acres so fairly good size), I can provide some background on why this is happening. The large farms are driving new equipment sales. They are the ones buying the brand new John Deere $700k combine harvesters will all the bells and whistles. The problem is, those bells and whistles add a lot of extra complexity to the machine, making it harde…

> By the time the equipment gets to the 3rd tier used market, it is already heavily deprecated. The loss in value due to poor repair-ability is not getting fed back up the chain in any significant way which would make the primary buyers change their decision making.

If the value is heavily depreciated by the time it reaches the “3rd tier” used market, why would the buyers in the “2nd stage” used market not factor this depreciation into the price they pay for it when they buy it used from the first owner? Surely people spending $700k on capital purchases know a thing or two about factoring in resell and depreciation into the prices they are willing to pay.

Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity

#319

Post by felipemnoa »

Vesuvium wrote: post #86
scarmig wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Milking your customers is not good for business, especially if you drive them into insolvency. It clearly is good for business, even if it's bad for customers and society at large. Pretending it's bad for business just encourages complacency because it suggests that the natural discipline of the market will drive the milkers out of business and encourage good business practices. But that doesn't happen, and if we w…

These companies are losing customers. That is never good for business. Eventually, someone will take the matter into his own hand and start making 80s-like tractors, so these companies will lose even more customers. They could do the same, but at this point they lost the trust of their customers, so it will be very hard to gain them back.

>>Eventually, someone will take the matter into his own hand

I believe you. This is how Netflix got born. A customer was so embarrassed about how Blockbuster milked him with late fees that he decided to start his own business. We all know what happened to Blockbuster.

Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity

#320

Post by hinkley »

SQL2219 wrote: post #304
hinkley wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stated another way, every company has discovered 'rent-seeking' in a relatively short period of time and they all think it's neat. Consumers haven't pushed back enough to stop this from happening.

nice thought, I had to look it up again: The classic example of rent-seeking, according to Robert Shiller, is that of a feudal lord who installs a chain across a river that flows through his land and then hires a collector to charge passing boats a fee to lower the chain. There is nothing productive about the chain or the collector. The lord has made no improvements to the river and is not adding value in any way, di…

I see the sentiment though that lead people to use that term.

The 'river' that manufacturers are putting a chain across is the First Sale Doctrine.

It's just rent-seeking wearing a mask. In a similar sense that the legal difference between a pyramid scheme and an MLM scheme is that the MLM scheme is accompanied by a good or service. Legally legitimate, but still morally objectionable.

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