A farmer in my village in Switzerland imported a 1980's Ford tractor from Texas. He had to repair the front axle, which had been cut. He told me the axle was cut to render the tractor unusable after it was traded in for some kind of emissions credit. Anyone hear of such a system?
For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity
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Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity
#232Disclaimer: I have been on a tractor exactly once in my life, no idea what any of the realities of this would be. But...
Doesn't it seem like there's a huge opening for Cheap Solid DIY Tractors Inc.? All I read about is how farmers hate tractors available now for their lock-in, their shitty software, their insane costs -- I wonder what's preventing someone from selling tractors that match the description listed in this article.
Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity
#233Earlier quoted context omitted.
To add some sources to this, the tractor companies have been milking farmers by forcing them to require subscriptions or use overpriced repair techs in order to get firmware updates/repairs. https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/kzp7ny/tractor-hacking-ri... https://www.npr.org/sections/alltechconsidered/2017/04/09/52...
This could be a business opportunity for another tractor manufacturer. You're not forced to buy a John Deere. Boutique tractors, hand repairable, simple parts. If people are hoarding onto 40 year old tractors, then that's a market signal that people want those type of tractors.
Yes, lets keep hoping the Market will solve everything, and that somehow, the trend of consolidation will magically reverse itself on its own, despite how ever fewer companies control each market. Wouldn't want to realize people have more power than just what they buy.
Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity
#234Earlier quoted context omitted.
Because it would be really expensive to start a new tractor manufacturing business; it would take years to even get prototypes up and running; you'd still have to prove that your tractors were as good as or better than these 40 year old antiques (which they probably wouldn't be at first); you'd have to be able to make something that could meet safety and efficiency standards of today while giving up the advantages of…
Could you not simply copy the 40 year old tractors almost exactly. Any patents should be expired.
Nope. If you did, I'm pretty sure the EPA would shut you down. Emissions regulations aren't quite as strict for tractors as for cars and trucks, but they are headed in the same direction. I don't think it's possible to meet emissions without computerized controls. And once you've put hundreds or thousands of dollars worth of electronics on the tractor, it's hard to resist the temptation to add DRM.
Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity
#235Earlier quoted context omitted.
What is the fear around robots? Machines have been displacing human labour for the last 100 years.
During the industrial revolution hard labor jobs transitioned to maintenance work for the machines. The problem is as we improve at automation the need for non-technical maintenance decreases. A small team of engineers can displace thousands or tens of thousands of workers without creating any new opportunities.
«A small team of engineers can displace thousands or tens of thousands of workers without creating any new opportunities.»
A corporation that did that would have significantly increased its profits, and this new wealth is often (not always) indirectly redistributed to society. For example the corporation could increase its production (ie. hiring more workers), or increase salaries/bonuses, or increase stock buybacks (therefore benefiting stock owners whoever they are), or spin off new business units, or decrease the prices of their products/services to further improve their competitiveness (hence benefiting customers), etc. Rarely does a corporation sit on piles of cash doing nothing (one notable counter-example: Apple.)
Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity
#236Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think human nature incentivizes top-down corporate business structures and disincentivizes co-op businesss structures.
Which is why 75% of France's farmers belong to an agricultural cooperative?
Are those profitable though? Farming is heavily subsidized by the EU.
Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity
#237Earlier quoted context omitted.
That seems rather implausible given that railroads came about at the same time.
Well, there would be a lot more bicycles and they could go a lot more places a lot faster, no? I.E. They would enable a much faster rate of genetic mutation.
Also isn't it a lot more comfortable cross-breeding in a sleeper car than on a bicycle? (Asking for a friend.)
Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity
#238My grandfather, rest his soul, was a 3rd generation rancher and farmer. He bought 2 John Deere tractors in the '80s and used them for 35 years. They are still being used to this day on the ranch. Growing up, I visited the ranch regularly. Farming and ranching is very hard on equipment so the tractors often needed repair. My father and grandfather could seemingly fix anything on the tractor without even needing to go…
The greatest innovation in the history of mankind was a land consolidation. It took what 100 peasants all making enough food for subsistence living to 100 peasants be able to make enough food for thousands of people. It's not sad, it's progress.
You should read 'The Storm Before the Storm' by Mike Duncan. It details the fall of the Roman Republic and highlights the role played by land consolidation and the social dislocation that gave rise to the empire. For better or worse, it was definitely less stable.
Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity
#239Earlier quoted context omitted.
Progress on a societal scale for certain. Sadness on the personal scale as new generations mourn the loss of their family's historical way of life. Both can exist :)
That only exists on a generational level. The generations born afterward will never know about it, and therefore not care because it wasn't embedded in their cultural perspective. It's like taking a childs binky away. Over time, you totally forget why you even had the thing in the first place.
No need to be condescending.
Re: For tech-weary Midwest farmers, 40-year-old tractors now a hot commodity
#240Earlier quoted context omitted.
Because it would be really expensive to start a new tractor manufacturing business; it would take years to even get prototypes up and running; you'd still have to prove that your tractors were as good as or better than these 40 year old antiques (which they probably wouldn't be at first); you'd have to be able to make something that could meet safety and efficiency standards of today while giving up the advantages of…
Could you not simply copy the 40 year old tractors almost exactly. Any patents should be expired.
I think that you would have a hard time getting EPA approval if you starting making brand new copies of legacy engine designs. A new diesel tractor engine has to meet EPA Final Tier 4/ Stage IV standards. I don't know what would stand in the way of making a knock off of the 4440 chassis and transmission that uses a new Cummins or other crate engine though.