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Ask HN: Are books worth it?

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Re: Ask HN: Are books worth it?

#391

Post by peteforde »

keiferski wrote: post #358
peteforde wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes! Enlightenment Now by Steven Pinker Sapiens by Yuval Noah Harari Astrophysics For People in a Hurry by Neil deGrasse Tyson bonus round: Thinking, Fast and Slow by Daniel Kahneman Shoedog by Phil Knight The Death of Truth by Michiko Kakutani

These are all pseudo, pop-science books. I would recommend reading the works of actual scientists and philosophers directly, or textbooks.

This is not a contribution. Telling someone asking for enjoyable books to read to skip bestselling books by Nobel laureates to instead read textbooks, whitepapers and other raw sources makes you sound like a pretentious asshole.

Re: Ask HN: Are books worth it?

#392

Post by peteforde »

ping_pong wrote: post #379
peteforde wrote: post #340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, it's been more than half of your sentient life since you tried reading a book that was written 200 years ago... and you're prepared to write off all of fiction as a waste of time? I am begging you to see if perhaps you might have a better experience today with a more contemporary book that frankly isn't kind of dull. I urge you to try audiobooks. There still exists a stigma that it's not "real" reading, but that…

Yes, for me I find it a waste of time. That's a personal choice. I read comic books if I have extra time, which I enjoy. And just to be clear, I loved the book Frankenstein and it had a profound effect on my life. I just never had any incentive after that to read another fiction book.

Okay, I'm not trying to change your mind... just humour me. I'm selfishly curious, and that's all: if you haven't done it in 25 years and you were only a decade into your conscious adulthood, does it not seem even slightly possible that ruling out all contempory fiction of every genre based on a 200 year old monster allegory means it's time for a check-in? I just don't understand how you can be on this forum and also hold such a strong belief that you have anywhere near enough information to make up your mind as a fifty year old.

What if you're wrong?

Re: Ask HN: Are books worth it?

#393

Post by peteforde »

ping_pong wrote: post #379
peteforde wrote: post #340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, it's been more than half of your sentient life since you tried reading a book that was written 200 years ago... and you're prepared to write off all of fiction as a waste of time? I am begging you to see if perhaps you might have a better experience today with a more contemporary book that frankly isn't kind of dull. I urge you to try audiobooks. There still exists a stigma that it's not "real" reading, but that…

Yes, for me I find it a waste of time. That's a personal choice. I read comic books if I have extra time, which I enjoy. And just to be clear, I loved the book Frankenstein and it had a profound effect on my life. I just never had any incentive after that to read another fiction book.

Again, I'm sorry if I'm pissing you off. I mean no harm.

You're just... kind of blowing my mind. I've just never met anyone with this particular set of beliefs before.

Re: Ask HN: Are books worth it?

#394

Post by DataGata »

marcoseliziario wrote: post #370
coldtea wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The people in the self-help section need something else. Those things (philosophy, literature, history and science) are the luxury of folks who aren't struggling with e.g. depression, abuse, drugs & alcohol, co-dependency, etc. Actually it's the inverse. A healthy dose of philosophy, literature, history and science are what people suffering from "depression, abuse, drugs & alcohol, co-dependency" can use to liberat…

Hardly. High culture takes a level of attention that someone who is struggling in life hardly will be able to attain. Moreover, philosophy is concerned with truth, and truth can sometimes be brutal. It would be almost criminal to recommend reading Nietzsche for someone who lost their job, got cheated and divorced and has some serious disease.

Well obviously you wouldn't do Nietzche (though I think you probably could). Meditations is probably the book to read in those cases.

Re: Ask HN: Are books worth it?

#395

Post by anthonypasq »

armitron wrote: post #362
randomsearch wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

+1 for Steinbeck being a “true master”. East of Eden and Grapes of Wrath essential.

I never understood the fascination of many Americans (I'm British) with Steinbeck. For me, Faulkner, Fitzgerald, Hemingway and even McCarthy and Melville are completely outclassing him. One American friend of mine once mentioned that Steinbeck is obligatory reading in many American schools but few read Faulkner. Maybe that has something to do with his popularity.

Faulkner is significantly more difficult.

Re: Ask HN: Are books worth it?

#396

Post by carapace »

dragonwriter wrote: post #385
carapace wrote: post #374

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The people in the self-help section don't know what they need or they wouldn't be looking for someone to tell them what they need. With respect, how do you know? Are you a priest or psychologist or psychic? > one can find at least as many anecdotes of ... and a lot more who ... I'm dubious but let's grant it for the sake of discussion. So what? I mean that's terrific if reading Marcus Aurelius' "Meditations" straig…

> With respect, how do you know? Basic logic: if you know what you need, you don't look for someone to tell you what you need. > Are you a priest or psychologist or psychic? Would the answer to that question have any relevance to anything no matter what it was? > So what? I agree that that's generally the appropriate response to (especially unverifiable) anecdotes offered as evidence but...that's kind of the point, g…

> Basic logic: if you know what you need, you don't look for someone to tell you what you need.

What if you know you need someone to tell you what you need?

> Would the answer to that question have any relevance to anything no matter what it was?

It might give some background as to why you make sweeping statements about an unbounded class like "people in the self-help sections". I mean, I did it, but it was a rhetorical flourish. If you challenged me on it I would give ground.

I think neither of us knows what ALL the people in ALL the self-help sections of ALL the world need, do we?

> I agree that that's generally the appropriate response to (especially unverifiable) anecdotes offered as evidence but...that's kind of the point, given the anecdote I was responding to.

What's the point? Are we trolling each other here or what?

I say these cheesy self-help books help some people. You say philosophy and literature have also helped some people. I agree with you.

Is there anything more to say? I've been beating this horse for three days now, I think it's dead, and anyway my arms are tired.

Re: Ask HN: Are books worth it?

#397

Post by dragonsngoblins »

>I assume that the best part of the best books will surface in daily conversations, YouTube videos, CliffsNotes, podcasts, Reddit posts/comments, blog articles, etc.

Are you exclusively talking about reading for learning or are you including reading for pleasure? Both are "worth it" in my opinion, but if you are including reading for pleasure the idea that anyone could think this blows my mind.

Do you enjoy film/TV? Because if so you could think of what I just quoted as being equivalent to saying "Oh I don't need to watch anything. I just eavesdrop on watercooler discussions and watch highlight clips".

Or in other words good books are more than the sum of their parts. CliffsNotes and comments can be interesting but won't include the full context, the playful uses of language, the pacing, and so much more.... They won't include the art of the text.

Re: Ask HN: Are books worth it?

#398

Post by crashbunny »

I believe 2 things about books (with no citations provided so don't believe me but if interest search for studies) reading books helps keep our memory and concentration in top shape, possibly reading long articles is OK in that regard, too.

Reading text books helps us learn things we didn't know we needed to know.

ie if you've learnt the basics of programming, you're going to solve programming problems using the skills you know. If you get stuck you might ask or search for a question framed with your current skills, it might be the wrong question to ask though, similar to the XY problem. You'll probably be able to solve the problem the way you want to solve the problem, but it could be the wrong way to solve the problem.

If you keep doing this, not reading text books on programming and just asking or searching for questions when you get stuck, it's going to take a lot longer to master the skill. This is all my opinion and not fact.

Re: Ask HN: Are books worth it?

#399

Post by BrendanEich »

combatentropy wrote: post #219

Most books are wordy. But then again so are most articles, podcasts, and videos. Good books, however, are some of my favorite things: The Language Instinct by Stephen Pinker, Mere Christianity by C. S. Lewis, On Writing Well by William Zinsser. One advantage of a book by someone who is both (a) an expert in the field, and (b) an expert at expression, is a coherent, thorough treatment of a subject, from start to finis…

David Flanagan wrote "JavaScript: The Definitive Guide", I did not. Not sure why you thought I did -- please tell me in case there is an error somewhere I can help correct. Thanks.

Re: Ask HN: Are books worth it?

#400

Post by jason_slack »

bbbobbb wrote: post #365
jason_slack wrote: post #364

I own about 600 books currently. Ranging from A-Z in terms of subject matter. When I've moved, it has been a huge hassle to box and move and re-shelve them. My wife gets pretty irritated about this. I wouldn't change this. Physical book on specific subject matter tend to be very thorough compared to any content I could find online. Physical books make me pay attention to it. They are right there in front. No blue lig…

What are your thoughts on ebooks? I have never had 600 books in my library but couple years ago when moving I simply got rid of every single physical book I owned. I have not bought a new one since. All my books are electronic and I don't feel like I am losing anything. Of course there is a chance that in 15 years all my backups are gone or nothing can read the several formats I have them in but how likely is that? A…

This is true. It’s valid.

For me if I carry a book with me I’m going to read it. Carrying the weight of the physical books ensures I read it. I don’t want to carry it around for nothing.

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