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Nokia CEO: Nokia is "standing on a burning platform"

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Re: Nokia CEO: Nokia is "standing on a burning platform"

#61

Post by chc »

ergo98 wrote: post #36
chc wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple has been making similar margins on all of its products for the past 10 years. How can you say it isn't sustainable?

10 years ago Apple had 5 billion in revenue. Now they're pushing 100 billion in revenue. They butting in on competitors who operate in the 5% margin range, and who are all desperately starting to claw back at Apple's gains. No, it isn't sustainable. History will prove me out, and in 3 years I would bet that Apple has seen a significant margin haircut. Quote me on a 50% decline. As a comparison, by the way, look at So…

One downvote on a site where the voting arrows are tiny and close together and votes can't be reversed is a "seminal moment that speaks volumes about a community"? I think you're being a little melodramatic.

Anyway, Apple has always had a disproportionate share of any market it seriously participated in — the big difference is that 10 years ago Apple was a very small part of a single market. Some fluctuations will probably happen over the next half a decade, but you can bet that Apple will remain absurdly profitable in a way that embarrasses most of its competitors. It's just something that Apple is good at.

Re: Nokia CEO: Nokia is "standing on a burning platform"

#62

Post by nl »

I think they might be looking at Android rather than WinMo7 (ok, maybe I'm just being hopeful...)

The memo repeatedly mentions innovation and market leadership.

With WinMo7 locked down as tightly as it is it is very difficult for a company to be innovative in that market.

OTOH, Android already has quite a diverse ecosystem, and would allow Nokia the opportunity to do it's own thing while still supporting an active developer community.

If Nokia was interested in WinMo7, why would they invest heavily in a Silicon Valley Engineering office (as opposed to a Seattle office)?

Finally, there is already a (very active, community) port of Qt to Android (http://code.google.com/p/android-lighthouse/). If Nokia got behind that it would give them a roadmap that would avoid alienating app developers who were hoping to support MeeGo.

Re: Nokia CEO: Nokia is "standing on a burning platform"

#65

Post by lotusleaf1987 »

ergo98 wrote: post #36
chc wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple has been making similar margins on all of its products for the past 10 years. How can you say it isn't sustainable?

10 years ago Apple had 5 billion in revenue. Now they're pushing 100 billion in revenue. They butting in on competitors who operate in the 5% margin range, and who are all desperately starting to claw back at Apple's gains. No, it isn't sustainable. History will prove me out, and in 3 years I would bet that Apple has seen a significant margin haircut. Quote me on a 50% decline. As a comparison, by the way, look at So…

|EDIT: Arrowed down. This is one of those seminal moments that speak volumes about a community, and I think HN is done (just furthering an observation that has grown). Account and site abandoned.

Wow seriously, overreaction much? I don't know how long after you edited your comment but you're +8 now. It seems a little petty to dismiss all of HN because your comment was downvoted. Big deal. You just have to put up with some downvoting and realize not everyone is always going to have the same opinion as yourself.

My guess is you'll be back tomorrow or the next day judging by your comment history.

Re: Nokia CEO: Nokia is "standing on a burning platform"

#66

Post by alex_c »

follower wrote: post #42
SandB0x wrote: post #12

> The battle of devices has now become a war of ecosystems, where ecosystems include not only the hardware and software of the device, but developers, applications, ecommerce, advertising, search, social applications, location-based services, unified communications and many other things. Our competitors aren't taking our market share with devices; they are taking our market share with an entire ecosystem. This means…

I'd rather Nokia actually be the only truly open mobile platform out there. No, Android isn't sufficiently open. It's my phone, at a minimum I should be able to pull all my own data off it in any form I choose.

The problem is that openness at the cost of user experience isn't good enough to keep a company alive. Ideally you'd get both, of course; but so far Nokia has been unable to deliver on user experience compared to iPhone and even Android.

Re: Nokia CEO: Nokia is "standing on a burning platform"

#67

Post by mkramlich »

robryan wrote: post #41
SandB0x wrote: post #12

> The battle of devices has now become a war of ecosystems, where ecosystems include not only the hardware and software of the device, but developers, applications, ecommerce, advertising, search, social applications, location-based services, unified communications and many other things. Our competitors aren't taking our market share with devices; they are taking our market share with an entire ecosystem. This means…

This is the way forward, a company that wants to develop native apps for mobile must already work with so many different systems. A new startup is going to focus on an iphone app, if they are successful or well capitalized from the start then they will look at android. The third choice in the market is shaping to be windows 7 phone. Expecting companies to develop for then yet another platform, one which seems to be r…

> This is the way forward, a company that wants to develop native apps for mobile must already work with so many different systems. A new startup is going to focus on an iphone app, if they are successful or well capitalized from the start then they will look at android. The third choice in the market is shaping to be windows 7 phone.

I agree with what you said here. But to take it a step further I'd say that the number one rule I've learned from doing mobile native apps the last few years is that ideally one should NOT be making mobile native apps. Make a web app, that just happens to look and interact decently on a mobile device. Saves developers a lot of pain and a lot of time otherwise invested in a more narrow platform set of skills.

Re: Nokia CEO: Nokia is "standing on a burning platform"

#68

Post by lotusleaf1987 »

edderly wrote: post #49

Ignoring the problems with WP7, if Nokia were to produce phones with other 'external' OSes why would they stick with just one? No one criticizes Samsung and they are pretty much a mobile-OS whore: SHP, Bada, WP7, Symbian (albeit a year or so ago), Android, Limo, etc. N.B. Regarding SHP: I can't remember the name properly but this was the old/existing Samsung feature phone platform, it probably has got rolled into Bad…

IMO, that's because Samsung doesn't have a clue and would rather hedge their bets. Most people I know who has a Samsung Galaxy, Captivate, etc have complained endlessly about the wait for updates.

Samsung's business is in selling phones, not developing a software platform and therein lies the problem. They make their bread and butter on planned obsolescence and in the process screw over their customers.

Re: Nokia CEO: Nokia is "standing on a burning platform"

#69

Post by lotusleaf1987 »

foobarbazetc wrote: post #37

The only way forward is to embrace WP7 and become the WP7 phone. Build apps and an ecosystem around that. Hell, get Microsoft to acquire Nokia and make WP7 exclusive. WP7 is a much better platform than Android anyway (in a couple of OS updates at least). There is no way that Nokia will ever win using Symbian/MeeGo or Android. If they stay the course then Nokia's dead and will never recover.

I agree with everything you said except I think there's a 0% chance of Microsoft buying Nokia, it doesn't fit their business model. Companies would not be as willing to license WP7 if MSFT were competing directly with them and able to undercut their competitor's prices.

Re: Nokia CEO: Nokia is "standing on a burning platform"

#70

Post by robryan »

mkramlich wrote: post #67
robryan wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the way forward, a company that wants to develop native apps for mobile must already work with so many different systems. A new startup is going to focus on an iphone app, if they are successful or well capitalized from the start then they will look at android. The third choice in the market is shaping to be windows 7 phone. Expecting companies to develop for then yet another platform, one which seems to be r…

> This is the way forward, a company that wants to develop native apps for mobile must already work with so many different systems. A new startup is going to focus on an iphone app, if they are successful or well capitalized from the start then they will look at android. The third choice in the market is shaping to be windows 7 phone. I agree with what you said here. But to take it a step further I'd say that the num…

For this to be truly a reality you would need mobile developers to expose more functionality to the web app. The web app could also become a common interface with lower level functionality, so say a camera on an android phone and an iphone could both expose a common js interface.
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