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Why introductory chemistry is boring: a long-term historical perspective

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Re: Why introductory chemistry is boring: a long-term historical perspective

#111
post #34

If I were a teacher, I would begin an introductory chemistry course with these words: “Chemistry is the single most important area of knowledge today and for all foreseeable future. (Sorry physics.) This is because the world we live in and we ourselves are built from atoms, and because all future progress, the very evolution of the human being, all rest now on our understanding of the limitless possibilities presente…

Pretty sure every kid who hears "is the single most important area" zones out for the rest because they know it's pointless intro material. Then they zone back in for the real material.

Re: Why introductory chemistry is boring: a long-term historical perspective

#113
post #26

You can replace chemistry with math in his article (and he sort of mentions this in context near the end). I can't remember once being shown the physical problems that drove progress in math until I reached calculus. I remember being bored to tears in algebra 2, a class which was basically being taught as linear algebra + trigonometry. It wasn't until the following summer that I discovered 3d transforms, and a bunch…

What I hated was having to memorize orbitals in freshman chemistry, then after taking modern physics as a junior, the orbitals were deduced easily. Anyway, I hated chemistry, as it seemed all rote memorization. Physics was so much better. It’s also more applicable to RF.

In high school chemistry, we had to memorize the periodic table in the sense of symbol name. I hated memorizing stuff, but I found a way to make it enjoyable - I wrote an adaptive flashcard program to use.

Re: Why introductory chemistry is boring: a long-term historical perspective

#114
> In 100 years, this was the shift. Chemistry, as something that one did, was relegated to more advanced courses. You would no longer be able to do chemistry by taking an intro course alone.

> The regress, then, would come in disregarding the empirical evidence entirely, and transforming chemistry entirely into something that one learned, rather than did.

The author makes some good points.

There are also some interesting connections to software.

The way many kids today learn how to write software today is by doing and using first, and only later learning what they're doing. That's possible thanks to the relentless compound effect of Moore's Law operating over six decades or so.

It doesn't work that way in chemistry. Chemistry kits used to be commonplace up until the 70s. Various chemicals (such as acetone, concentrated isopropanol, and even certain drugs) used to be commonly available over the counter without hassle. Safety concerns have obliterated that pathway. There has been no Moore's Law making chemistry safer, cleaner, or more engaging over the last 60 years.

So the path to professional chemist (or even enthusiastic amateur) is completely different from the path to professional programmer.

Oddly enough, I see YouTube starting to re-kindle the idea that you can do amazing things at home with some ordinary materials and a little know-how. No, you don't have to read the whole damn book and take all the tests before showing off.

Tinkering with powerful things you're not qualified to use is incredibly addictive.

Re: Why introductory chemistry is boring: a long-term historical perspective

#115
post #101
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I can't remember once being shown the physical problems that drove progress in math until I reached calculus. Progress in math often (or usually) isn’t driven by physical problems, so there’s that. Just like progress in physics often (or usually) isn’t driven by “real world” problems. Discoveries are often made before applications are found. As a concrete example, number theory is an incredibly profound and fruitfu…

The pure mathematician is a relatively recent beast though, and most non-graduate students of math (i.e. almost all of them) study mathematics that almost exclusively was developed to solve a problem in the physical world.

Euclid was a pure mathematician.

Re: Why introductory chemistry is boring: a long-term historical perspective

#116

Why does chemistry have to be less boring? We are not short on chemists. Take it from someone who left the field Exploding balloons, frozen roses, elephant toothpaste are all very unlike what a chemist will do for a living after they've been lured into the field with this magician's act. Personally I don't think it's a bad thing if the classes are a little dry. It's true chem lab is a bit too much like following cook…

> Why does chemistry have to be less boring? We are not short on chemists.

Because there's more to life, education and knowledge than just being grist for the mill of capitalism.

Re: Why introductory chemistry is boring: a long-term historical perspective

#117
post #86
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I can't remember once being shown the physical problems that drove progress in math until I reached calculus. Progress in math often (or usually) isn’t driven by physical problems, so there’s that. Just like progress in physics often (or usually) isn’t driven by “real world” problems. Discoveries are often made before applications are found. As a concrete example, number theory is an incredibly profound and fruitfu…

> Progress in math often (or usually) isn’t driven by physical problems This is true at the largest scale, but the math classes that most people take are directly applicable to (and often were developed partly to solve) physical problems. I, too, found the high school presentation of math dry and boring until I took a good physics class, and I was amazed by how much of the math I learned was directly useful for that…

> failing both the applied and pure camps

Yes. Neither its use nor truth. Just a bunch of stuff to learn.

Much less could be covered if driven by applications/problems or from axioms, and the rest of the math ecosystem is built around it. So, hard to change.

Re: Why introductory chemistry is boring: a long-term historical perspective

#119

You can replace chemistry with math in his article (and he sort of mentions this in context near the end). I can't remember once being shown the physical problems that drove progress in math until I reached calculus. I remember being bored to tears in algebra 2, a class which was basically being taught as linear algebra + trigonometry. It wasn't until the following summer that I discovered 3d transforms, and a bunch…

race car dynamics is a great math application of interest. and good for algebra through diff eq

Re: Why introductory chemistry is boring: a long-term historical perspective

#120
post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Progress in math often (or usually) isn’t driven by physical problems, so there’s that. Just like progress in physics often (or usually) isn’t driven by “real world” problems. Discoveries are often made before applications are found. The use of math however is driven by physical problems for most people; teaching people how to use math (or physics, or chemistry) ought to be the point of most non-grad level courses?…

That doesn't work for everyone though. I'm studying pure math and I find most applied math problems very boring. I also like solving puzzles, though. If a problem is little more than knowing which formula to use (with some manipulation) and then punching the values into my calculator then it just feels like I'm doing a computer's job. So I think if we gear our curriculum too heavily to the applied side of things, we…

I would say 'plug and chug' applied problems don't work for anyone, past the first couple. At risk of anecdote: I like solving puzzles as much as anyone[1] but the purer side wasn't a puzzle to me because there is no purpose, no picture to be pieced together[2].

[1] Back to the original topic, chemistry interestingly inverts its approach with organic chem - a class in puzzle solving that often frustrated premeds trying to memorize their way through.

[2] I don't mean that the problem was open-ended, e.g. research but rather that it didn't exist. Most of my math education hasn't been trying to prove P=NP (or other easier puzzles) but demonstrating specific transformations (e.g. here are the rules for integration, after a trivial treatment of the proof). imo something like an intro to algorithms in highschool or early college would have do more for both the uninterested and the gifted than "integration, but with 1 more dimension!"

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