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How an Alzheimer’s ‘cabal’ thwarted progress toward a cure

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Re: How an Alzheimer’s ‘cabal’ thwarted progress toward a cure

#91

>scientists whose ideas fell outside the dogma recounted how, for decades, believers in the dominant hypothesis suppressed research on alternative ideas: They influenced what studies got published in top journals, which scientists got funded, who got tenure, and who got speaking slots at reputation-buffing scientific conferences Not quite in topic, but Is it really such a stretch to acknowledge that the same forces i…

maybe but the topic is quite polarised now and the foundamentalists are tolerated to avoid giving munition to the deniers, which might cause even bigger divisions on the public opinion.

Re: How an Alzheimer’s ‘cabal’ thwarted progress toward a cure

#92
post #77

>scientists whose ideas fell outside the dogma recounted how, for decades, believers in the dominant hypothesis suppressed research on alternative ideas: They influenced what studies got published in top journals, which scientists got funded, who got tenure, and who got speaking slots at reputation-buffing scientific conferences Not quite in topic, but Is it really such a stretch to acknowledge that the same forces i…

There's certainly evidence of bias in climate science, but if anything it's been towards understating the effect [1] [1] https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/scientists...

according to climate predictions we'd be underwater today in pescara but they would have not be an issue as we would also have dief of all the cancer from the ozone layer depletion.

change is real, damn this winter we got 15+ degree Celsius instead of the ten cm snow we usually got when I was a kid, the local effects are quite evident, and the trajectory spells real dangers, but past predictions were definitely overstating the effects, no wonder people have doubts about current predictions

Re: How an Alzheimer’s ‘cabal’ thwarted progress toward a cure

#93
The article is not quite updated. Biogen did end their phase 3 trial of the amyloid-beta antibody Aducanumab early, citing lack of efficacy. A closer look at the numbers however appeared to reveal that they shouldn't have. And Biogen is now filing Aducanumab for approval by FDA. [1]

All in all, there is no question that amyloid-beta is a key part of Alzheimer. Already Alois Alzheimer, when first describing Alzheimer's disease, noted amyloid-beta plaques as a key pathological finding. Amyloid-beta plaques are a characteristic of the disease, and a proper Alzheimer diagnosis requires the presence of amyloid-beta plaques.

Many variants of early-onset Alzheimer are caused by mutations either directly in APP (the precursor to amyloid-beta) or genes intimately involved with APP-processing (e.g. PSEN1 and PSEN2). These mutations often cause extreme levels of amyloid-beta and amyloid plaques.

Raised levels of amyloid-beta and amyloid plaques is a necessary condition for Alzheimer's disease, both early- and late-onset. But it's clearly not a sufficient criteria: many people have brains full of plaques and amyloid-beta, but little or no cognitive decline.

So the problem with Alzheimer's research is not so much the understanding that amyloid-beta is a significant part of the story, but rather focusing on it as the only part of the story and the only conceivable solution.

[1] https://edition.cnn.com/2019/10/22/health/biogen-alzheimers-...

Re: How an Alzheimer’s ‘cabal’ thwarted progress toward a cure

#94
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's certainly evidence of bias in climate science, but if anything it's been towards understating the effect [1] [1] https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/scientists...

according to climate predictions we'd be underwater today in pescara but they would have not be an issue as we would also have dief of all the cancer from the ozone layer depletion. change is real, damn this winter we got 15+ degree Celsius instead of the ten cm snow we usually got when I was a kid, the local effects are quite evident, and the trajectory spells real dangers, but past predictions were definitely overs…

You mention the ozone layer depletion as evidence of past exaggeration when in fact it's evidence of how a concerted, international effort can deal with an environmental issue.

Re: How an Alzheimer’s ‘cabal’ thwarted progress toward a cure

#95

The truth has a habit of shining through if you are encouraged to keep asking questions and follow up on them. The point is that people are actively discouraged from asking questions and following up on them. People lose their careers and livelihoods for asking the wrong sorts of questions. Truth is no barrier to social backlash. In fact, questions that might be true tend to be the ones that get people the most heate…

On the specific topic of IQ and scientific racism, the "centrist" position of "just asking questions" has been a cloak for agendas and not caring about the truth for a while now. Exhibit A: https://mobile.twitter.com/Simon_Whitten/status/117331966332... Exhibit B, what happens when you actually dig into the science behind the most well known peddler of the IQ is real and important, therefore racism is actually not a…

There's definitely a lot of agendas being pushed. But I'm not sure why we're being expected to trust numbers like 100% and 0% - what makes these numbers inherently more "objective" than other possibilities such as, let's say 90% and 10%?

Re: How an Alzheimer’s ‘cabal’ thwarted progress toward a cure

#96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the specific topic of IQ and scientific racism, the "centrist" position of "just asking questions" has been a cloak for agendas and not caring about the truth for a while now. Exhibit A: https://mobile.twitter.com/Simon_Whitten/status/117331966332... Exhibit B, what happens when you actually dig into the science behind the most well known peddler of the IQ is real and important, therefore racism is actually not a…

>"On the specific topic of IQ and scientific racism, the "centrist" position of "just asking questions" has been a cloak for agendas and not caring about the truth for a while now" That is the price for _having_ a truth. All sides must be allowed to argue, because sometimes _you_ are the one on the wrong side and just don't know it.

You can’t simply join scientific debate while ignoring the existing findings.

Genetics and race are almost completely unrelated with black in America including people that 7 out of 8 white great grand parents. So, arguing your measurements are of genetic differences needs to account for such non biological social constructs. Good faith research can follow the social construct of race, but it needs to address that elephant in the room.

Re: How an Alzheimer’s ‘cabal’ thwarted progress toward a cure

#97

The truth has a habit of shining through if you are encouraged to keep asking questions and follow up on them. The point is that people are actively discouraged from asking questions and following up on them. People lose their careers and livelihoods for asking the wrong sorts of questions. Truth is no barrier to social backlash. In fact, questions that might be true tend to be the ones that get people the most heate…

On the specific topic of IQ and scientific racism, the "centrist" position of "just asking questions" has been a cloak for agendas and not caring about the truth for a while now. Exhibit A: https://mobile.twitter.com/Simon_Whitten/status/117331966332... Exhibit B, what happens when you actually dig into the science behind the most well known peddler of the IQ is real and important, therefore racism is actually not a…

>If there are systemic social biases against groups with genetic genes the impacts of these will be 100% explained by the presence of these genes

That makes sense, but according to Plomin there's also an opposite (and counterintuitive to most people) effect, which over time increases the influence of genetics over the influence of the environment: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lev8dGnxvdw&t=4m43s

Re: How an Alzheimer’s ‘cabal’ thwarted progress toward a cure

#98
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought that it was also strongly associated with gum disease: https://www.alzheimers.net/alzheimers-and-gingivitis-disease...

Yes, which drove suspicion of a bacterial link. It could be quite complex -- bacteria helping herpes, or herpes helping bacteria into the brain, and the brain responding to one or the other or both with inflammation and plaques. And maybe something else involved, like inadequate or excess dietary intake of something like sugar, or trans fats, or PCBs, or glyphosate. We need to explore many, many possibilities.

Gum disease is linked to carbohydrates, which aligns with the "type 3 diabetes" hypothesis.

(carbs feed bacterial overgrowth)

Re: How an Alzheimer’s ‘cabal’ thwarted progress toward a cure

#99

The truth has a habit of shining through if you are encouraged to keep asking questions and follow up on them. The point is that people are actively discouraged from asking questions and following up on them. People lose their careers and livelihoods for asking the wrong sorts of questions. Truth is no barrier to social backlash. In fact, questions that might be true tend to be the ones that get people the most heate…

Why did you have to go straight in on "race science"? The history there is that "inherent inferiority" has been used to justify everything from legal discrimination to actual genocide. "Race science" has killed more people than nuclear weapons and poisoned more lives than tetraethyl lead.

It's the clearest example where a simple disclaimer like "I'm not racist but" is no more adequate than handling plutonium with kitchen gloves. It needs to be kept in an extremely safety-orientated environment, not splashed all over the internet.

Re: How an Alzheimer’s ‘cabal’ thwarted progress toward a cure

#100
A super interesting article, but the title is pure clickbait. In this day and age, feeding into the narrative that science is just another competitive team sport where people compete with whatever means necessary is downright dangerous.

Reality is much more nuanced, and the article actually does a good job of detailing that.

In some sense this all started from the very beginning, from when Alzheimer's disease (AD) was first described: In 1911, Alois Alzheimer found plaques in his dementia patient's brain. [0] These plaques are what researchers would focus on for more than the next 100 years.

Much later, the protein giving rise to the plaques (APP) was discovered and there seemed to be good evidence for a causal role: Mice with mutated APP developed AD.

Quoting the article:

"""

By the mid-1990s, a now-defunct San Francisco biotechnology company, Athena Neurosciences, created the first genetically engineered mice with a mutated, amyloid-producing human gene. The animals’ brains filled with amyloid plaques, and their memories were destroyed. The mice were hailed as a “model for testing therapeutic [Alzheimer’s] drugs”

"""

So we should really take this story as a cautionary tale. There was, however, no conspiracy or "cabal". These were simply people who were convinced they were on the right track. In a way, they were, since hereditary Alzheimer's is caused by APP mutations, it just turns out that this isn't as important as other ways of developing the disease.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Auguste_Deter

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