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Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

reuters.com

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Re: Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

#321

Post by Johnny555 »

softwaredoug wrote: post #188

Former Boeing employee here[1]: I remember when the company decided to do all 401k matching in Boeing stock in 2009. It seemed like a sketchy, borderline unethical way to keep the stock price afloat. All to say I’m happy to have transitioned all my 401k years ago! [1] I worked in the defense industry. Nothing to do with planes: my company was acquired by Boeing and operated relatively independently.

I remember when the company decided to do all 401k matching in Boeing stock in 2009.

I thought that was the norm? I've only worked at one public company and they did matching in company stock as well - I'd periodically sell it and reinvest so only about 20% of my holdings was in company stock. I wish I'd kept more in their stock since they've done quite well.

Re: Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

#322

Post by doublement »

lokedhs wrote: post #293
jolmg wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> most people in the US only cares about ticket price, which means that even if an airline wants to improve their quality they can't use it to compete With regards to quality, do airlines in other places generally provide more bang for the buck or are they just generally more expensive than US flights to provide for the higher quality?

To be honest, I don't know. It's hard to compare for the US domestic flights, since you have to decide on comparable routes. That said, flights throughout Asia at distances similar to US domestic flights tend to be reasonably cheap. I decided to make a comparison: Fly Singapore Airlines from Singapore to Hong Kong. This will cost you 225 USD in economy. A domestic US flight of the same distance would be San Francisco…

Albuquerque isn't a major destination though. Flying to provincial cities is always expensive.

A better comparison with about the same distance in the US is New York to Miami, which can be done nonstop for under $200 on Delta, or $135 on whatever "Frontier" is.

EDIT: In fact you can go from New York to Las Vegas for under $200, round-trip, which is considerably farther.

Re: Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

#323

Post by AnimalMuppet »

pseudalopex wrote: post #315
AnimalMuppet wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm. There's been a lot of talk here about the Boeing culture vs. the Lockheed culture, and how the Lockheed culture took over after the merger. Yet the CEO was a Boeing guy, not a Lockheed guy.

Do you mean McDonnell Douglas? Muilenberg became CEO 18 years after the merger. I wouldn't expect him to exemplify Boeing's old culture. It was also only 6 months before the first 737 MAX flight.

Oops. Yes.

His lineage is in the Boeing culture, not the McDonnell Douglas culture.

Re: Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

#324

Post by guitarbill »

lokedhs wrote: post #261
dredmorbius wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Airlines consider passenger misery a benefit: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21530964 Jules Dupuit, describing rail carriages, though the same logic applies: It is not because of the several thousand francs which they would have to spend to cover the third class wagons or to upholster the benches. ... [I]t would happily sacrifice this [expense] for the sake of its popularity. Its goal is to stop the traveler wh…

Or you can do what many other airlines do, which is to make business class so much better that even if econony is nice, business class is so much above that that it's worth the money. I tend to try to travel on Qatar, and their new business class cabins are amazing: https://www.qatarairways.com/en/onboard/qsuite.html It's also cheaper than the (worse) business class on many other airlines.

The inconsistency of business class does make it unappealing though. Sometimes, it's almost first class (Singapore Airlines). Many times, it's barely a step up from economy though, and just feels like a rip off.

Re: Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

#325

Post by matwood »

softwaredoug wrote: post #188

Former Boeing employee here[1]: I remember when the company decided to do all 401k matching in Boeing stock in 2009. It seemed like a sketchy, borderline unethical way to keep the stock price afloat. All to say I’m happy to have transitioned all my 401k years ago! [1] I worked in the defense industry. Nothing to do with planes: my company was acquired by Boeing and operated relatively independently.

And depending on when you got your match you would still be way ahead of the S&P 500.

Re: Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

#326

Post by asperous »

pytester wrote: post #258
munk-a wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At some point we (society at large) are going to realize these fluffy c-level people are toxic and remove value from companies - then, ideally, we'll move back to a default of promoting internally.

There needs to be a broader cultural backlash against the cult of MBAs first.

As a programmer who got an MBA, I can tell you that in my cohort there were absolutely extremely smart super stars who put the time into everything they do and have the talent to make good decisions and have the empathy to be good managers. There were also people who tried their best but their judgement was clearly lacking.

My cohort has Civil Engineers, Materials engineers, Physicians, Finance, Accountants.. and also art students and communication students.

All this to say you can't generalize a whole degree.

Re: Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

#327

Post by rosybox »

fooster wrote: post #200
doublement wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ...single-aisle monoculture makes flying miserable. What is it that people expect when they say flying is miserable? I expect safety, which is why I'll never get on a 737 MAX. Other than that, I just put sandwiches and snacks in my pocket, fill my water bottle, and in X hours I'm thousands of miles away. Air travel is actually pretty amazing.

I expect to be able to sit in my seat without having my knees crushed? How about that for a start?

I'm 6'2" and my knees used to be painfully squeezed into seats and everything was incredibly uncomfortable on flights. At the time I weighed 275lb. I've since lost weight and I was surprised how much more comfortable flying is.

You wouldn't think being obese would impact knees not having enough space, but my ass shrank in multiple directions and I have about four to five inches of free space now between the seat in front of me and my knees. Unless you're much taller than I am, it's likely that losing weight will not just help with your health, but make flying more comfortable.

If you are taller, well, life sucks for us tall people in many ways and we can't expect airlines to build comfortable seats for people two or three standard deviations beyond the normal height.

Re: Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

#328

Post by heelix »

lokedhs wrote: post #293
jolmg wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> most people in the US only cares about ticket price, which means that even if an airline wants to improve their quality they can't use it to compete With regards to quality, do airlines in other places generally provide more bang for the buck or are they just generally more expensive than US flights to provide for the higher quality?

To be honest, I don't know. It's hard to compare for the US domestic flights, since you have to decide on comparable routes. That said, flights throughout Asia at distances similar to US domestic flights tend to be reasonably cheap. I decided to make a comparison: Fly Singapore Airlines from Singapore to Hong Kong. This will cost you 225 USD in economy. A domestic US flight of the same distance would be San Francisco…

The routes and dates really matter. I can fly from MSP to TPA (about 2.1k, about the same) for $28 USD. Now I wont argue Frontier airline is the same quality as Delta or some of the other majors... but airfare prices are really fungible.

Re: Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

#329

Post by yellowapple »

sudoaza wrote: post #281
georgeecollins wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> Most business in the United States is done despite of management, not because of it. You must be very unhappy in your cubicle.

have you seen anyone ever happy in a cubicle?

I'm moving from an open-office floor plan to a cubicle, and can attest myself as one example of someone who very soon will be happy in a cubicle.

Re: Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

#330

Post by SkyMarshal »

lokedhs wrote: post #293
jolmg wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> most people in the US only cares about ticket price, which means that even if an airline wants to improve their quality they can't use it to compete With regards to quality, do airlines in other places generally provide more bang for the buck or are they just generally more expensive than US flights to provide for the higher quality?

To be honest, I don't know. It's hard to compare for the US domestic flights, since you have to decide on comparable routes. That said, flights throughout Asia at distances similar to US domestic flights tend to be reasonably cheap. I decided to make a comparison: Fly Singapore Airlines from Singapore to Hong Kong. This will cost you 225 USD in economy. A domestic US flight of the same distance would be San Francisco…

You probably need a larger sample to draw any conclusions, especially during a holiday season.
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