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Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

reuters.com

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Re: Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

#251

Post by rightbyte »

discretelious wrote: post #35
devit wrote: post #11

Why isn't it enough to retrofit all past and future models with enough hardware redundancy and create a properly written MCAS software? Wasn't the design sound, except for the lack of hardware sensor redundancy and naively written software? Why do they need to stop production and so on?

The issue is not that this plane kills people— although it is shocking that this plane does kill people. The issue is that a culture of self-interested mismanagement from factory floors up to our highest political offices has led the global economy to depend on the success of this plane which kills people. Even if somehow by chance they manage to make this plane kill fewer people in the future, there will be no reaso…

Does the global economy really need passenger planes? Tourism economies, sure, but I would guess most of the economy is dependent on trains, trucks and ships?

Re: Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

#252

Post by wonderwonder »

panarky wrote: post #95
solatic wrote: post #4

After both The Economist[1] and The New York Times [2] publicly undermined faith in Dennis Muilenberg. No question at this point that he needed to be replaced. The question is - why didn't the board act sooner? [1] https://www.economist.com/leaders/2019/12/18/boeings-misplac... [2] https://www.nytimes.com/2019/12/22/business/boeing-dennis-mu...

The NYT story in particular was hard-hitting and well sourced. Gotta wonder if these stories influenced the board to act now. It's a bad look, because Boeing is consistently way too late to recognize what is obvious to those of us watching from home. I continue to be astounded that our most senior leaders will not act in the long-term best interest of the organizations they lead. It's been 37 years since the Tylenol…

Because today's leaders are judged only on this quarters returns for shareholders. Companies are seen only as investment vehicles for the most part. This is especially true in companies that have large minority stake holders that like to make noise. Leaders like Musk can still declare that they are going to run at a loss for the next few years as they ramp up but he is in a unique position where he controls the majority of the shares. If Musk was not the majority shareholder at Tesla there is a large chance he could have been asked to step down a while ago. Tesla is doing great now but for a while it was very touch and go. Large investment firms want year over year positive growth, they don't care about mission statements or the fact that the company owes pensions to lifelong employees. Its profits over people now.

Re: Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

#253

Post by Rebelgecko »

oska wrote: post #94
JetBen wrote: post #62

I'm really glad to see that there is at least some type of corporate accountability going on for so many people dying. This probably should have happened sooner.

Quoting from the Code of Hammurabi (Ancient Babylon): > If a builder builds a house for someone, and does not construct it properly, and the house which he built falls in and kills its owner, then that builder shall be put to death. There's real accountability for you. Corporate accountability these days is a sick joke.

The Code of Hammurabi also had different punishments for the same crime depending on the wealth/social status of the victim. Some things don't really change.

Re: Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

#254

Post by softwaredoug »

vkou wrote: post #238
softwaredoug wrote: post #188

Former Boeing employee here[1]: I remember when the company decided to do all 401k matching in Boeing stock in 2009. It seemed like a sketchy, borderline unethical way to keep the stock price afloat. All to say I’m happy to have transitioned all my 401k years ago! [1] I worked in the defense industry. Nothing to do with planes: my company was acquired by Boeing and operated relatively independently.

I love that idea for 401k matching. All the downsides of a pension [1], combined with all the downsides of a 401k[2], with none of the upsides of either! [1] If your employer goes belly up after you retire, you are screwed. [2] Because it's fixed contribution, as opposed to fixed payout, if you lived longer than you planned, you are screwed.

Exactly! We could transition our stock out, but that setup employees with the lovely complication of having to learn about insider training and how to NOT do it...

Re: Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

#255

Post by [deleted] »

Rebelgecko wrote: post #253
oska wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoting from the Code of Hammurabi (Ancient Babylon): > If a builder builds a house for someone, and does not construct it properly, and the house which he built falls in and kills its owner, then that builder shall be put to death. There's real accountability for you. Corporate accountability these days is a sick joke.

The Code of Hammurabi also had different punishments for the same crime depending on the wealth/social status of the victim. Some things don't really change.

[deleted]

Re: Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

#256

Post by softwaredoug »

softwaredoug wrote: post #188

Former Boeing employee here[1]: I remember when the company decided to do all 401k matching in Boeing stock in 2009. It seemed like a sketchy, borderline unethical way to keep the stock price afloat. All to say I’m happy to have transitioned all my 401k years ago! [1] I worked in the defense industry. Nothing to do with planes: my company was acquired by Boeing and operated relatively independently.

Another funny thing is I once got in trouble for tweeting about the “Boeingaucracy” of our new employers. I was shocked that someone cared about my dumb twitter account. It was pretty early on for being so paranoid about monitoring a brands social media image!

Re: Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

#257

Post by lokedhs »

fooster wrote: post #200
doublement wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ...single-aisle monoculture makes flying miserable. What is it that people expect when they say flying is miserable? I expect safety, which is why I'll never get on a 737 MAX. Other than that, I just put sandwiches and snacks in my pocket, fill my water bottle, and in X hours I'm thousands of miles away. Air travel is actually pretty amazing.

I expect to be able to sit in my seat without having my knees crushed? How about that for a start?

One option is to not fly american airlines (with a lower case a). The highest rated US airline is 3 out of 5 stars on Skytrax.

As far as I understand, the reason for this is that foreign airlines are not allowed to fly US domestic routes, and most US people don't fly international which means they don't know that things could be better.

It also seems like people in the US to a greater extent than other countries only cares about ticket price, which means that even if an airline wants to improve their quality they can't use it to compete because customers will simply not see them, since they sort by price on the travel site and pick the first one on the list.

Re: Boeing CEO ousted as 737 Max crisis deepens

#258

Post by pytester »

munk-a wrote: post #233
pizlonator wrote: post #215

So I read somewhere than Muilenburg was the only engineer in the Boeing C suite. There were no pilots in the C suite. And this was part of the problem. The new CEO has a degree in accounting. I bet he’ll do great.

At some point we (society at large) are going to realize these fluffy c-level people are toxic and remove value from companies - then, ideally, we'll move back to a default of promoting internally.

There needs to be a broader cultural backlash against the cult of MBAs first.
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