Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback • Hacker News Board

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#151

Post by HarryHirsch » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 1:59 AM UTC

allthecybers wrote: post #112

As a Support Engineer for a well known tech company, I took on the extracurricular role of sourcing, screening and interviewing candidates for our team. We often had better results identifying candidates as an engineer making a direct contact. You do walk a fine line and create a lot of overhead to give feedback to all candidates. Generic feedback like "you weren't the right candidate" or "we were looking for someone…

More detailed feedback can be tainted with personal bias and potentially skewed personal perspective based on how well you got along with an interviewer

Absolutely. Two weeks ago, interview at a certain top-10 liberal arts college. Meetings with 4 or 5 faculty members, the usual.

Chitchat throughout, nothing substantial is being said, certainly nothing pertaining to the role. There is a tour of the facilities, the research labs are empty, even though the semester is still ongoing. You marvel at the unstructuredness of it all and ask: is this Potemkin's Village? The general impression is that the institution is living on past glories.

The rejection arrives in less than a week, and just for grunts, you ask if there is any feedback to be had. There is feedback: the interviewers could not assess your competence.

Guys, it was your job to convey expectations and bring the conversation back on track, if necessary. You just managed to turn a disappointed candidate into a completely enraged one. What a waste of time. People talk to each other, if anyone asks about the institution I would strongly recommend not to have anything to do with it, not as student, not as faculty, not as staff.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#152

Post by eropple » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 2:00 AM UTC

Thorentis wrote: post #145

> They are especially scared to give negative feedback to candidates out of fear that it might be misinterpreted as discrimination. >There is also the concern over a social media backlash because of something an employee said to a candidate. This right here, is 90% of it. Sure, the other stuff like too few resources, or too many applicants is partly true, but the crux of it is that people are far too sensitive right…

It's that people are too sensitive, is it? Or is it that "culture fit" excuses...uh...suck?

The hand-wringing sorts who are simultaneously so protective of a company's "culture" but are so unable to substantiate how someone might not fit in in a way that isn't telling on themselves should be worried, but not because somebody might get mad at them on Twitter. It's because they're at best losing out on good candidates and at worst perpetuating dark and shitty behaviors onto people who don't deserve it.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#153

Post by [deleted] » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 2:01 AM UTC

[deleted]

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#154

Post by ryandrake » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 2:03 AM UTC

hailwren wrote: post #76

rconti wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's your field and geo area? I don't think I've ever applied for more than 6 jobs in a round of looking. And more often than not I haven't even had to look. ~20 years, bay area.

It's sort of complicated. I did a boot camp, 100 applications 3 interviews 0 offers, went back to school (Harvard, the real one not the extension school) and am currently doing the summer internship grind (30 applications 3 interviews 0 offers). But I'm CS.

Don’t worry. I’m 20 years into my career and the last job hunt was about 100 applications, 10 interviews or phone screens, and 1 offer. Anyone who can get an offer out of less than 10 applications in this difficult job environment is either very lucky or a top-0.1% wizard in his field.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#155

Post by solveit » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 2:07 AM UTC

jeffdavis wrote: post #143

monksy wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As long as it's not in a phone call. That's a huge waste of time just to be told that they're passing. Google insisted on a call. It's just annoying.

A phone call is considered more respectful than an email. It may waste time, but signs of respect often do.

Wasting time is the feature. The fact that it wastes the caller's time as well is the reason that it works as a sign of respect.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#156

Post by solveit » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 2:08 AM UTC

mlthoughts2018 wrote: post #141

gwbas1c wrote: post #83

As a candidate, I've always preferred polite "thanks, but no thanks" responses in a timely manner. The other kind of feedback that I like is things like, "we need people with a different background / experience than you have." IMO, judgement feedback (you screwed up how you handle your yak shaving, or I don't think we'll get along with each other) is too subjective to be constructive. And, I get it. As someone who's…

> “It's safer to pass on a good candidate than hire a bad employee.” After a decade of building teams in machine learning, I regard this as one of those hallowed mythical pieces of wisdom that is just totally wrong. It dramatically over-estimates both the chances and costs of hiring a bad employee, while discounting the huge, huge opportunity cost of not hiring rare, exceptional candidates. I’d much rather spend a ye…

How large is your company?

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#157

Post by HarryHirsch » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 2:13 AM UTC

adamredwoods wrote: post #124

awinder wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The asymmetry is actually pretty funny if you think about what happens when a candidate declines an offer or ghosts a company. If you ghost, they’re likely going to continue to contact over multiple channels. Because they want an answer so that they can take next steps. Same as a candidate. If you say thanks but no thanks, they’re going to want to know why, is there anything they could have done differently, or try t…

Not asymmetrical, in my opinion. Companies are holding all the cards, otherwise I wouldn't be looking for a job in the first place. I believe that someday there will be too few jobs for all the people on this planet.

someday there will be too few jobs for all the people on this planet

There are too few jobs now. Paul Krugman called it a "savings glut". There are no opportunities to invest the cash you are holding productively, consequently interest rates are low and the best thing you can do is buy back your own stock.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#158

Post by exabrial » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 2:19 AM UTC

I would love to be able tell applicants why we didn't choose them to help them along in their job search or clear up any misconceptions. There problem is it is a risk to a business with 0 chance of making it more profitable. Chalk this up as overregulation at it's finest having predictable secondary affects.

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#159

Post by VPN_SIDEHUSTLE » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 2:22 AM UTC

rconti wrote: post #79

hailwren wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's sort of complicated. I did a boot camp, 100 applications 3 interviews 0 offers, went back to school (Harvard, the real one not the extension school) and am currently doing the summer internship grind (30 applications 3 interviews 0 offers). But I'm CS.

Ugh. I hear that first step can be rough. I took a non-traditional path so it wasn't an issue for me. I didn't realize internships were so hard to get, though.

What was your non traditional path?

Re: Reasons Why Job Seekers Are Not Given Feedback

#160

Post by benjohnson » Fri, Dec 20, 2019, 2:22 AM UTC

ativzzz wrote: post #94

SkyPuncher wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Don't do free projects for companies. It's never worth it. In my experience, I'd never get hired if I took this approach. Work samples are quickly becoming the interview standard for engineering. In fact, I find they're often completely replacing all day onsite interviews. I'd much rather do 8 hours of self-directed, self-paced work than get grilled on a whiteboard during an on-site.

The company I work at pays a lowish rate for our 10 hour take home project, which is also the last step of the interview process. I think this is a great practice, as this shows that we're taking this seriously and are willing to compensate for your time.

Perhaps be careful - we did this until someone filed for unemployment benefits. They used the fact that we paid them as evidence of employment to the state.