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Depression and suicide linked to air pollution in new global study

theguardian.com

71–80 of 204 posts

Re: Depression and suicide linked to air pollution in new global study

#71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And it is not a placebo effect. How do you know?

I think he means based on the size of the effect it's unlikely to be a placebo.

right, but 50% of the effect of opiates is placebo, so we shouldn't be too surprised. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11207392

Re: Depression and suicide linked to air pollution in new global study

#72
post #26

also: look into anti nutrients, some of the depression might just be nutrient deficiency. Can be tested by fasting for 4 days.

If that's the case, how would fasting work? Wouldn't it just reliably deprive you from nutrients hence give you a depression?

I don't know why, but there are a lot of people where fasting works for depression. Then there are ways of eating which seem to have an effect like low fodmaps. Etc.

Re: Depression and suicide linked to air pollution in new global study

#73
post #7

> The results show strong correlations, but research that would prove a causal link is difficult because ethical experiments cannot deliberately expose people to harm. This is kind of my hobby horse: you don't need to subject people to harm to test causuality. You can do the opposite: Remove harm and see what happens. Maybe give people free HVAC upgrades to filter more particles.

>Maybe give people free HVAC upgrades to filter more particles.

Or just reduce pollution in the first place! AFAIK, manufacturing and running HVAC would add more pollution and cost more than switching (for instance) from internal combustion engines to electric vehicles. Or even better, cycling within cities. etc.

Re: Depression and suicide linked to air pollution in new global study

#74
post #8

I live in Northern India which has heavy air pollution. I recently bought an air purifier. Just the difference in the quality of sleep is amazing. And it is not a placebo effect. The filters are already visibly grimy. The PM 2.5 consistently now is around mid 20s down from around 180-190. I would recommend it to all in North India who can afford it, esp households with small children.

I'd bet than investing in cleaner vehicles (ICE > EV) and energy source (call > renewable/nuclear) would have much greater health and climate benefits and for much higher ROI.

Re: Depression and suicide linked to air pollution in new global study

#75

Not sure how to reconcile this with the fact that suicide rates in rural areas of the US far exceed suicide rates in urban areas. Do the availability of guns in rural areas really offset this effect that much?

In the UK there was a study on social isolation comparing rural and urban people to evaluate the assumption that people in "isolated" rural areas are lonely. It found the reverse - that people in urban areas are more socially isolated.

https://www.co-operative.coop/campaigning/loneliness

"The report briefly mentions the ‘rurality factor’ as presenting greater barriers to connection, with rural areas having fewer and more expensive support services such as transport links. However, it goes on to suggest that ‘rural communities were felt to be less closed off than their urban counterparts’, with rural participants more likely to ask how people are, or stop for chats."

Re: Depression and suicide linked to air pollution in new global study

#77
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This seems ripe for placebo. Installing purifier and indeed measuring lower PM, means naturally you feel less worried and more relaxed!

It's time to hire someone to maybe break the filter somewhen for a duration. And hack the meter to report invalid data.

I've always thought it would be an interesting service where someone did this with medication/supplements. They sent you supplies of both the real and sugar pill meds for a certain duration and you recorded how you felt.

Re: Depression and suicide linked to air pollution in new global study

#78

I'm pretty confident that depression is not a result of air pollution, but rather that both air pollution and depression are results of industrialization. The problem is not chemical. The problem is how we live.

What gives you this certainty?

Re: Depression and suicide linked to air pollution in new global study

#79

Nothing was more depressing than growing up in LA in the 1970s, lungs hurting, and 30% of PE classes cancelled because of smog. I remember looking at the sickly yellow light casting this disgusting puce sheen on the asphalt. The city was all I knew, and I hated it. Once a year we would go up to the Eastern Sierra and I felt released, natural, like this was how the world should be. Returning home to the smog and traff…

I didn't grow up there during that time, but moved there in the late 70's. There were indeed many smoggy days. But surprisingly it got much better after about 10 years. I assume it was a result of stricter regulations. These days the air quality in the LA area is generally pretty good, with historical PM2.5 data showing "green" most of the time http://aqicn.org/city/los-angeles/

Re: Depression and suicide linked to air pollution in new global study

#80
post #78

I'm pretty confident that depression is not a result of air pollution, but rather that both air pollution and depression are results of industrialization. The problem is not chemical. The problem is how we live.

What gives you this certainty?

Bayesian priors, I reckon.
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