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Amazon, Apple, Google, and the Zigbee Alliance to develop connectivity standard

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Re: Amazon, Apple, Google, and the Zigbee Alliance to develop connectivity standard

#291

Post by ma2rten »

joshstrange wrote: post #235
singingboyo wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I, on the other hand, am on the 17th floor. Anyone who can holler at a smart device in my apartment has already compromised something important, and could probably get in anyway. Also, just require a passphrase? To go full star trek, "[Alexa/Google/Siri], unlock the front door, authorisation singingboyo Alpha Pi Pi Zulu" sounds workable.

IIRC Amazon does allow for this. I use Smartthing + Homebridge for operating my lock (Prompts me on my phone to unlock the door when I get near the house and locks the door when I close it) but I do have Alexa as well and I at least looked into using it to lock/unlock. For the unlock I have to read off a pin, it will lock without needing a pin.

We truly live in the future.

Re: Amazon, Apple, Google, and the Zigbee Alliance to develop connectivity standard

#292

Post by RonanTheGrey »

BiteCode_dev wrote: post #186
themagician wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We don’t need that. You’re right that technology isn’t going to save us though. You can just, you know, not use Alexa. Normal light switches continue to work. Windows still exist for checking the local weather and are probably more reliable than Alexa is.

I don't have any kind of smart speakers or camera at home. The problem is that many other people I visit do. It's the same issue with Google products in general: I don't have a gmail address. My phone don't even have an email tied to it and I don't use the official store. But because my contacts mostly do those things, google still has a log of all my conversations, my face in pictures, my positions, etc. But even th…

Yeah but !!!!1111eleventyomgz

"Just don't buy it hahahaha checkmate" completely ignores the fact that even though I now choose not to do business with Google, I am still many times a day forced to use their Captcha or visit sites that host their ads (which I block, btw).

Saying "we don't need that you just need not to buy it" is exactly the same situation. All we are asking for is a reasonable way to opt out - and actually opt out. These technologies are made viral by design to collect maximally valuable data from their users, and the very idea that someone might want to opt out is totally ignored.

I personally don't own any of these devices and will never allow one in my home. I feel sorry for my kids that they will grow up with all their friends talking about them and not be able to share in it - and I will explain to them why.

Re: Amazon, Apple, Google, and the Zigbee Alliance to develop connectivity standard

#293

Post by semi-extrinsic »

mavhc wrote: post #234
Symmetry wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's also the bit where Zigbee devices have to share a secret key to talk to each other, mostly to prevent competition from low cost devices manufactured in China.

When they kept the already known secret key for pairing bulbs in the new supposedly secret version of Zigbee it was obvious they didn't care about security at all

After all the "S" in IoT stands for Security.

Re: Amazon, Apple, Google, and the Zigbee Alliance to develop connectivity standard

#294

Post by tjoff »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #290
istillwritecode wrote: post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will no longer install apps on my phone to pair devices. The reason is that then everyone wants to link my phone number to the device and create an account. There is nothing that intrinsically says they have to, but companies cannot resist asking for a unique identifier that happens to be linked to everything else in your life. No thank you.

So who says you should need their app? It should be a published protocol, and then you use whatever app you want that speaks the protocol instead of some heinous dreck from the manufacturer.

The part where they can't resist?

So no, there will not be a published protocol.

Re: Amazon, Apple, Google, and the Zigbee Alliance to develop connectivity standard

#295

Post by tjoff »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #288
Avamander wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Out-of-band pairing is a better idea, e.g. some key on the bulb has to be entered or scanned or read on the device.

The trouble with that is that you can't change it in case e.g. some temporary visitor to your house snaps a picture of the key.

That shouldn't do them any good. The device should require it to be in pairing mode for the key to do anything.

Re: Amazon, Apple, Google, and the Zigbee Alliance to develop connectivity standard

#296

Post by istillwritecode »

teekert wrote: post #55
aequitas wrote: post #20

> The goal of the Connected Home over IP project is to simplify development for manufacturers... > The industry working group will take an open-source approach for the development and implementation of a new, unified connectivity protocol and increase compatibility for consumers. Curious if I as a hobbyist will benefit from this? Or if this will become a: it works perfectly, but only if all your devices connect to ou…

I really hope they recognize the need that people want to keep their data on their lan. Actually that would be required by the GDPR if they won't let me sign anything. My derived data is my own people, it does not belong to who ever collects it. I.e. I just want a thermostat the is a big rotating button and speaks mqtt. It does not exist. If you want it to look good you end up with a Nest thermostat. Home Assistant n…

I had several Google Home devices, and you could not even boot them up unless you had a phone with an account that was opted into location history, web history, search history, and youtube watch history. Google has completely lost any concept of privacy.

Re: Amazon, Apple, Google, and the Zigbee Alliance to develop connectivity standard

#297

Post by hanklazard »

teekert wrote: post #55
aequitas wrote: post #20

> The goal of the Connected Home over IP project is to simplify development for manufacturers... > The industry working group will take an open-source approach for the development and implementation of a new, unified connectivity protocol and increase compatibility for consumers. Curious if I as a hobbyist will benefit from this? Or if this will become a: it works perfectly, but only if all your devices connect to ou…

I really hope they recognize the need that people want to keep their data on their lan. Actually that would be required by the GDPR if they won't let me sign anything. My derived data is my own people, it does not belong to who ever collects it. I.e. I just want a thermostat the is a big rotating button and speaks mqtt. It does not exist. If you want it to look good you end up with a Nest thermostat. Home Assistant n…

I use Venstar thermostats with Home Assistant. They're totally fine, but wifi only I believe. Local API, so no cloud nonsense. I've been running them for about a year with no major problems.

Re: Amazon, Apple, Google, and the Zigbee Alliance to develop connectivity standard

#298

Post by JackRabbitSlim »

mistersquid wrote: post #254
TheKarateKid wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FireWire also had a few port types which required different cables and connectors, while USB at the time only had one (this was before Mini and Micro USB). Apple even included dongle converters with their iPods. USB also had the advantage of Intel pushing it, resulting in almost every PC with an Intel CPU (large majority) having USB ports.

> USB also had the advantage of Intel pushing it, resulting in almost every PC with an Intel CPU (large majority) having USB ports. In the mid to late 1990s, USB was scarce. It didn't take off until after Apple replaced its ADB (Apple Desktop Bus) port with USB in the first iMacs. Once that happened, manufacturers flooded the market with consumer products (e.g. CDRW drives) and PC makers followed suit. Up to that poi…

That neglects to mention that Microsoft Windows 95 OSR2 launched a few months before (97) and that entire release was centered around better USB support for a broader range of components. (e.g. CDRW Drives)

I don't think its fair to say PC "Followed suit" in using USB.

Re: Amazon, Apple, Google, and the Zigbee Alliance to develop connectivity standard

#299

Post by syshum »

Spivak wrote: post #217
Symmetry wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's also the bit where Zigbee devices have to share a secret key to talk to each other, mostly to prevent competition from low cost devices manufactured in China.

Yeah! They want you to use the high cost devices manufactured in China.

No, American Marketing Companies (Apple, Amazon, Google, Etc) want to use the Cheap China Manufacturers, they just dont want consumers to be able to buy them direct

Re: Amazon, Apple, Google, and the Zigbee Alliance to develop connectivity standard

#300

Post by JackRabbitSlim »

matt-attack wrote: post #226
pkulak wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Amazon is choosy on what features you can implement Allowing someone to holler into an open (or recently broken) window to open my front door sounds terrifying.

I bet you sleep fine knowing anyone can simply pick your locks to get in using knowledge easily obtained on YouTube and using tools readily available.

That statement is equally true for fancy "smart" systems.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32815036036.html

sleep tight.

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