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The falling price of a TV set

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Re: The falling price of a TV set

#91
post #3

"The trade-offs for cheap TVs is that customers are themselves becoming the product for TV makers [...] For something to be as cheap as a great TV, people have to give something up — whether they know it or not." Just never give the TV its own direct connection to the internet. Use another device that you do trust, to feed the big screen its content.

Roku TVs are one of the higher rated smart tv platforms, so is there a difference between plugging in a roku device or just using a roku tv?

Re: The falling price of a TV set

#92
post #48
post #38

I do not understand why the prices of these have not fallen to $0, in much the same way an inktjet printer has. Or why the TV does not come as a freebie with some kind of (cable, otherwise) content subscription. (Disclaimer: I hate “smart” TVs)

Have you ever tried to sell a TV? Much like diamonds or cars, it seems that a lot of their value derives from the "primary-market freshness guarantee." For base-model TVs, the secondary-market price (e.g. the one you'd get at a pawn shop) is essentially zero. People aren't really buying base-model TVs, though. Who wants a 30" 30Hz 720p non-HDR display (let alone an old CRT or plasma TV), even for free? "I'd rather wa…

> Who wants a 30" 30Hz 720p non-HDR display (let alone an old CRT or plasma TV), even for free? "I'd rather watch shows on my phone than on that piece of junk" is a pretty common thing to hear when someone is being offered one of these.

That's exactly the kind of TV (and somewhat better, actually) that you can thrift or find on Craigslist for free or so-cheap-it's-almost-free.

Re: The falling price of a TV set

#93
post #83

If you look at a chart of TV prices over 50-80 years, this has always been a trend [1]. Institutes using this as an argument for declining poverty are missing the point that while most goods have gone down in cost over the years, services (childcare) and things of value (education) have gone up substantially [2]. [1]: http://www.businessinsider.com/chart-of-the-day-the-incredib... [2]: Elizabeth Warren's classic "Twi…

But how much cheaper is it to learn a profitable skill? In the 1980s I’d have had a much harder time learning to code. I learned essentially for free. A traditional, hand holding education is more expensive, but information is virtually free.

Blooms 2 Sigma problem [1] suggests that while it is cheaper to get access to the material, you’ll do better if taught by an expert tutor.

[1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloom%27s_2_sigma_problem

Re: The falling price of a TV set

#94
post #83

If you look at a chart of TV prices over 50-80 years, this has always been a trend [1]. Institutes using this as an argument for declining poverty are missing the point that while most goods have gone down in cost over the years, services (childcare) and things of value (education) have gone up substantially [2]. [1]: http://www.businessinsider.com/chart-of-the-day-the-incredib... [2]: Elizabeth Warren's classic "Twi…

But how much cheaper is it to learn a profitable skill? In the 1980s I’d have had a much harder time learning to code. I learned essentially for free. A traditional, hand holding education is more expensive, but information is virtually free.

I learned it from the K&R and Mapping the Amiga I checked out of the local library, and a Heathkit manual I had from somewhere.

Of course I didn't learn the programming discipline until college many years later, and it shows in my early code.

Re: The falling price of a TV set

#95
post #83

If you look at a chart of TV prices over 50-80 years, this has always been a trend [1]. Institutes using this as an argument for declining poverty are missing the point that while most goods have gone down in cost over the years, services (childcare) and things of value (education) have gone up substantially [2]. [1]: http://www.businessinsider.com/chart-of-the-day-the-incredib... [2]: Elizabeth Warren's classic "Twi…

But how much cheaper is it to learn a profitable skill? In the 1980s I’d have had a much harder time learning to code. I learned essentially for free. A traditional, hand holding education is more expensive, but information is virtually free.

That’s because you’re not actually paying for the education itself but access to the network of people who also can afford it plus the brand name of the institute.

Re: The falling price of a TV set

#96

If you look at a chart of TV prices over 50-80 years, this has always been a trend [1]. Institutes using this as an argument for declining poverty are missing the point that while most goods have gone down in cost over the years, services (childcare) and things of value (education) have gone up substantially [2]. [1]: http://www.businessinsider.com/chart-of-the-day-the-incredib... [2]: Elizabeth Warren's classic "Twi…

What sucks is that the cycle of falling prices and models being replaced is so fast that they become not worth repairing -- or impossible to repair -- within a few years.

I trashed an otherwise perfectly good 4-5 y/o 49" television last year because something on the IR receiver board failed. What leads I could find for a replacement board (a) had them listed around 50% of what a comparable replacement television cost and (b) didn't actually have any to sell me.

Upside, now even my rarely-used guest bedroom rates a fairly cheap 55" 4K smart TV. This holiday season the same money buys their 65-inch model, next year it'll probably buy a 70.

Re: The falling price of a TV set

#97
post #62

>With less demand for actual TVs, there’s less reason for manufacturers to price them even more highly. I don't buy this reasoning. Tablets and phones supposedly replaced laptops and desktops (or so I've heard), yet the prices for those hasn't really budged in the past couple of decades. >But the most interesting and telling reason for why TVs are now so cheap is because TV manufacturers have found a new revenue stre…

I just bought an Honor Magicbook for $600 that's plenty powerful for a development laptop. My first development PC (Pentium 166) cost $3500 in the mid 90s, so factor that with inflation.

Re: The falling price of a TV set

#98

If you look at a chart of TV prices over 50-80 years, this has always been a trend [1]. Institutes using this as an argument for declining poverty are missing the point that while most goods have gone down in cost over the years, services (childcare) and things of value (education) have gone up substantially [2]. [1]: http://www.businessinsider.com/chart-of-the-day-the-incredib... [2]: Elizabeth Warren's classic "Twi…

I think this is called "cost disease"[1].

To your examples, however, non-university education has gone down precipitously in price. I'm teaching myself machine learning and financial trading for essentially free, with tools and resources that significantly exceed what was available to people 20 years ago. I think the most useful skill today is "learning how to learn" and I don't think it's taught very well in our public education system. I know that hiring tutors and professionals and coaches is valuable and that self-education isn't a panacea, but we're certainly in a better spot than we were 30 years ago.

Childcare in San Francisco ranges from $1,000/month to $4,000/month. Was ye olde "cheap childcare" of days passed less expensive than $1000/month adjusting for inflation? I remember old childcare centers from the 1980s had significant problems compared to the relatively posh, highly regulated, childcare centers available today. Another big problem with childcare is the childcare tax credit which is a laughably small amount. From a government revenue-maximization perspective, it seems silly to discourage dual income households from continuing to stay dual income. But maybe the CBO has figured this all out and I'm completely wrong.

I certainly agree with you that certain things have gone up significantly in price (healthcare and housing come to mind), but I think it's at the very least debatable that standards of living have gone down.

[1]Scott Alexander has a very interesting blog post on the phenomenon of "cost disease": https://slatestarcodex.com/2017/02/09/considerations-on-cost...

Re: The falling price of a TV set

#99
As soon as I read the title, I knew the answer. It's because you can no longer buy a "TV set". What you can buy is yet another sort of snooping device, which happens to show TV.

> But the most interesting and telling reason for why TVs are now so cheap is because TV manufacturers have found a new revenue stream: advertising. If you buy a new TV today, you’re most likely buying a “smart” TV with software from either the manufacturer itself or a third-party company like Roku. The cut of the advertising revenue from those pre-installed video channels is big business for actual TV makers, as is the business of selling user viewing data and other information to marketers.

So yet another thing that I will never buy.

Re: The falling price of a TV set

#100
post #83

If you look at a chart of TV prices over 50-80 years, this has always been a trend [1]. Institutes using this as an argument for declining poverty are missing the point that while most goods have gone down in cost over the years, services (childcare) and things of value (education) have gone up substantially [2]. [1]: http://www.businessinsider.com/chart-of-the-day-the-incredib... [2]: Elizabeth Warren's classic "Twi…

But how much cheaper is it to learn a profitable skill? In the 1980s I’d have had a much harder time learning to code. I learned essentially for free. A traditional, hand holding education is more expensive, but information is virtually free.

You picked one skill -- computer programming -- which just happens to be the one the internet is built on. It should come as no surprise that the internet is a great place to learn that for free.

The further you get from that, the worse teacher the internet is. There are many skills I've learned which are hard to find information about online, and a few which don't seem to exist on the internet at all.

Not every profession has someone who took the time to sit down and put all their knowledge on the internet for free. Some fields are just getting around to putting it in books.

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