Amazon is now delivering half its own packages, rivaling FedEx and UPS • Hacker News Board

Re: Amazon is now delivering half its own packages, rivaling FedEx and UPS

#21

Post by bsder » Mon, Dec 16, 2019, 9:57 PM UTC

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #19

One side effect of the growth of Amazon is the replacement of "decent" jobs with absolutely soul sucking ones. In the early 2000's I knew people that worked as delivery drivers for UPS or FedEx and it was a decent job. They seemed happy. Now I see the Amazon delivery people, and they look majorly stressed out as if they are on the edge of collapse. Many times they are delivering things at 10pm desperately trying to m…

> It seems the "decent" jobs are going away, replaced by ones that turn workers into robots to better extract value from their labor.

http://marshallbrain.com/manna1.htm

Re: Amazon is now delivering half its own packages, rivaling FedEx and UPS

#22

Post by paulmd » Mon, Dec 16, 2019, 9:59 PM UTC

Shivetya wrote: post #12

Keverw wrote: post #4

Pretty amazing you can go from being a little tiny online bookstore to owning your own fleet of planes, trucks and vans. Very inspiring story. Also like when they are close to you, it tells you how many stops away they are in the app. So useful if you ordered something and excited to get it. However it seems when they used UPS packages would get here earlier like noon to 2PM, while Amazon own drivers seem to be a lit…

I am just amazed they determined buying the thousands, if not tens of thousands of trucks, recruiting and training drivers, and the logistics of it all, was better for them than what they could negotiate from the delivery giants and USPS. I would assume they considered shipping items for others including pickup and delivery from customer homes. I just cannot believe it is only for delivery of their own goods

they're not buying the trucks and recruiting the contractors, it is more gig-economy bullshit. You are a 1099 worker who rents your own truck and whatever is left over is what you get.

Re: Amazon is now delivering half its own packages, rivaling FedEx and UPS

#23

Post by Kovah » Mon, Dec 16, 2019, 10:01 PM UTC

The same happens here, but DHL is the major player being replaced and it makes total sense for both Amazon and its customers. To be honest, since my first delivery made directly by Amazon, until now, I never missed a single package. It was delivered on time, most times on the day after the order. DHL on the other side has horrible drivers that would just drop off the package at the next post station, instead of knocking on your damn door, while you are at home. This is absolutely frustrating and I really hate DHL for that. From what I heard (no hard facts, sorry) the payment of the drivers is not really worse than those of the DHL drivers. Yet they do a lot better job.

Personally, I don't understand the matter of having to pay nothing for the shipping of online orders. Why don't they charge at least 3€, which is then used to pay the drivers more? A regular DHL package costs about 6€, not including the package material itself. I would appreciate paying more for the delivery if I knew that the drivers receive a better salary with that.

Re: Amazon is now delivering half its own packages, rivaling FedEx and UPS

#24

Post by WrtCdEvrydy » Mon, Dec 16, 2019, 10:04 PM UTC

bsder wrote: post #21

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #19

One side effect of the growth of Amazon is the replacement of "decent" jobs with absolutely soul sucking ones. In the early 2000's I knew people that worked as delivery drivers for UPS or FedEx and it was a decent job. They seemed happy. Now I see the Amazon delivery people, and they look majorly stressed out as if they are on the edge of collapse. Many times they are delivering things at 10pm desperately trying to m…

> It seems the "decent" jobs are going away, replaced by ones that turn workers into robots to better extract value from their labor. http://marshallbrain.com/manna1.htm

I love MANNA every time it gets linked, I love reading it.

Re: Amazon is now delivering half its own packages, rivaling FedEx and UPS

#25

Post by standardUser » Mon, Dec 16, 2019, 10:05 PM UTC

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #19

One side effect of the growth of Amazon is the replacement of "decent" jobs with absolutely soul sucking ones. In the early 2000's I knew people that worked as delivery drivers for UPS or FedEx and it was a decent job. They seemed happy. Now I see the Amazon delivery people, and they look majorly stressed out as if they are on the edge of collapse. Many times they are delivering things at 10pm desperately trying to m…

Traditionally it has been unions that have placed a check on employers' perpetual quest to trade humanity for efficiency.

Re: Amazon is now delivering half its own packages, rivaling FedEx and UPS

#26

Post by spike021 » Mon, Dec 16, 2019, 10:07 PM UTC

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #19

One side effect of the growth of Amazon is the replacement of "decent" jobs with absolutely soul sucking ones. In the early 2000's I knew people that worked as delivery drivers for UPS or FedEx and it was a decent job. They seemed happy. Now I see the Amazon delivery people, and they look majorly stressed out as if they are on the edge of collapse. Many times they are delivering things at 10pm desperately trying to m…

>Now I see the Amazon delivery people, and they look majorly stressed out as if they are on the edge of collapse. Many times they are delivering things at 10pm desperately trying to meet their quotas.

Even UPS sounds.. not great. I have a friend who's a delivery driver for UPS and especially this time of year he has days where his truck is loaded with 250-300 parcels and they're basically all supposed to be delivered by evening. They even hire temp guys as runners who ride along in trucks to help the drivers get the packages dropped off quicker. Not only that but if they do clear their truck and they have fellow guys in their route who still have a load to clear, they tend to be asked to stick around and help take that load. But it means 10-12 hour or more shifts in some cases.

It's the Amazon/online shopping craze, and seems like it isn't a very easily scalable problem.

Re: Amazon is now delivering half its own packages, rivaling FedEx and UPS

#27

Post by behringer » Mon, Dec 16, 2019, 10:08 PM UTC

annoyingnoob wrote: post #5

Keverw wrote: post #4

Pretty amazing you can go from being a little tiny online bookstore to owning your own fleet of planes, trucks and vans. Very inspiring story. Also like when they are close to you, it tells you how many stops away they are in the app. So useful if you ordered something and excited to get it. However it seems when they used UPS packages would get here earlier like noon to 2PM, while Amazon own drivers seem to be a lit…

Oh, Amazon does not own all of the delivery infrastructure, though they certainly own some of it. https://logistics.amazon.com - you too can work 7 days a week for whatever peanuts Amazon decides to throw at you, all while 'owning your own business' that is totally and completely dependent on Amazon and the success of Amazon.

And doing and performing exactly as Amazon demands.

Re: Amazon is now delivering half its own packages, rivaling FedEx and UPS

#28

Post by tharne » Mon, Dec 16, 2019, 10:09 PM UTC

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #19

One side effect of the growth of Amazon is the replacement of "decent" jobs with absolutely soul sucking ones. In the early 2000's I knew people that worked as delivery drivers for UPS or FedEx and it was a decent job. They seemed happy. Now I see the Amazon delivery people, and they look majorly stressed out as if they are on the edge of collapse. Many times they are delivering things at 10pm desperately trying to m…

I think we're all guilty of contributing to this problem. We all say we're for livable wages and then don't vote with our dollars as often as we should. I'm definitely guilty of going to Amazon because a book is a few dollars cheaper there and I can get it in two days instead of a week.

If we care about workers and corporate behavior, we need to be willing to pay a little more for products that are made by companies who's ethics we can get behind. Purism and System76 are good examples of this in the laptop space.

When we do vote with our dollars, the results are often impressive, as seen by the surge in availability of organic meat and produce.

Re: Amazon is now delivering half its own packages, rivaling FedEx and UPS

#29

Post by kelnos » Mon, Dec 16, 2019, 10:12 PM UTC

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #19

One side effect of the growth of Amazon is the replacement of "decent" jobs with absolutely soul sucking ones. In the early 2000's I knew people that worked as delivery drivers for UPS or FedEx and it was a decent job. They seemed happy. Now I see the Amazon delivery people, and they look majorly stressed out as if they are on the edge of collapse. Many times they are delivering things at 10pm desperately trying to m…

FedEx and UPS are likely hit by this as well. Given driver behavior in the past few years (throw packages at doorstep, buzz all units in building and don't wait for an answer before speeding off), they're probably judged on packages delivered, so they're optimizing for quantity, not quality.

I wouldn't blame Amazon's logistics group for this, but simply the rise of delivery shopping (in large part fueled by Amazon). It's really hard to scale that, especially at the low (or zero) shipping prices customers have been trained to expect.

Re: Amazon is now delivering half its own packages, rivaling FedEx and UPS

#30

Post by snowwrestler » Mon, Dec 16, 2019, 10:21 PM UTC

Amazon is pulling a fast one here, and The Verge is letting them get away with it. Here’s the key part:

> it’s also been building out a network of its own delivery drivers under the Amazon Flex platform, which is a kind of on-demand contract network similar to Uber and food delivery companies like DoorDash.

So, in fact Amazon is not delivering their own packages, they are employing an ad-hoc network of local truckers to deliver their packages. This is in contrast to FedEx and UPS, who employ the men and women who leave boxes on your doorstep.

This matters because:

> (Amazon Flex has been plagued by damning reports that the high demands it places on Flex drivers have directly contributed to automobile fatalities.)

I’m sure Amazon intends to build out a full shipping network, which is the only way to optimize both quality and cost in shipping. The reality is, they are still a long way from doing so.