Conscious Perception Of Vision Occurs Outside The Visual Cortex
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Re: Conscious Perception Of Vision Occurs Outside The Visual Cortex
#2This research seems to be based on the assumption that visual illusions happen in the conscious domain.
Was that firmly established? That would imply for example that animals can't fall for optical illusions which seems wrong - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcXXQ6GCUb8
Re: Conscious Perception Of Vision Occurs Outside The Visual Cortex
#3This research seems to be based on the assumption that visual illusions happen in the conscious domain. Was that firmly established? That would imply for example that animals can't fall for optical illusions which seems wrong - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcXXQ6GCUb8
> That would imply for example that animals can't fall for optical illusions.
why?
Re: Conscious Perception Of Vision Occurs Outside The Visual Cortex
#4This research seems to be based on the assumption that visual illusions happen in the conscious domain. Was that firmly established? That would imply for example that animals can't fall for optical illusions which seems wrong - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcXXQ6GCUb8
The idea that animals are not conscious comes from religion, not science.
The only conscious entity that I’m 100% positive exists is myself. If you reject solipsism, none of the traditional criteria that tell apart humans from animals (e.g. language or ethics) hold up to scientific scrutiny as far as consciousness is concerned.
The criteria that have been scientifically vetted (based on information theory among others) also hold for animals and other living beings (genes known as transcription factors form network that are isomorphic in form and function to neuronal circuits).
Re: Conscious Perception Of Vision Occurs Outside The Visual Cortex
#5This research seems to be based on the assumption that visual illusions happen in the conscious domain. Was that firmly established? That would imply for example that animals can't fall for optical illusions which seems wrong - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcXXQ6GCUb8
The idea that animals are not conscious comes from religion, not science. The only conscious entity that I’m 100% positive exists is myself. If you reject solipsism, none of the traditional criteria that tell apart humans from animals (e.g. language or ethics) hold up to scientific scrutiny as far as consciousness is concerned. The criteria that have been scientifically vetted (based on information theory among other…
While you are right that we can't exclude the possibility of animals being consciousness, it's well accepted that their conscious level is very low compared to ours.
Re: Conscious Perception Of Vision Occurs Outside The Visual Cortex
#6This research seems to be based on the assumption that visual illusions happen in the conscious domain. Was that firmly established? That would imply for example that animals can't fall for optical illusions which seems wrong - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcXXQ6GCUb8
They aren't looking at all visual illusions, they are only looking at the double-drift illusion. In the paper they say the goal of the study was to use the position shift from this particular illusion to investigate where that perceived position emerges in the processing hierarchy.
They say that the double-drift illusion reveals an integration of motion signals over a second or more, which they say makes it unlikely that early visual areas are responsible for the accumulation of position errors because they have short integration time constants.
It seems more like supporting evidence that some illusions are in the conscious domain? It would interesting to see if there have been any studies on the double-drift illusion and animals.
Re: Conscious Perception Of Vision Occurs Outside The Visual Cortex
#7Earlier quoted context omitted.
The idea that animals are not conscious comes from religion, not science. The only conscious entity that I’m 100% positive exists is myself. If you reject solipsism, none of the traditional criteria that tell apart humans from animals (e.g. language or ethics) hold up to scientific scrutiny as far as consciousness is concerned. The criteria that have been scientifically vetted (based on information theory among other…
While you are right that we can't exclude the possibility of animals being consciousness, it's well accepted that their conscious level is very low compared to ours.
What's a conscious level?
Re: Conscious Perception Of Vision Occurs Outside The Visual Cortex
#8This research seems to be based on the assumption that visual illusions happen in the conscious domain. Was that firmly established? That would imply for example that animals can't fall for optical illusions which seems wrong - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcXXQ6GCUb8
They aren't looking at all visual illusions, they are only looking at the double-drift illusion. In the paper they say the goal of the study was to use the position shift from this particular illusion to investigate where that perceived position emerges in the processing hierarchy. They say that the double-drift illusion reveals an integration of motion signals over a second or more, which they say makes it unlikely…
I get that.
But why can't we have later visual areas, but who are still at an unconscious level? From where the implication that if it's late or has long integration time is conscious?
Re: Conscious Perception Of Vision Occurs Outside The Visual Cortex
#9This research seems to be based on the assumption that visual illusions happen in the conscious domain. Was that firmly established? That would imply for example that animals can't fall for optical illusions which seems wrong - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcXXQ6GCUb8
The idea that animals are not conscious comes from religion, not science. The only conscious entity that I’m 100% positive exists is myself. If you reject solipsism, none of the traditional criteria that tell apart humans from animals (e.g. language or ethics) hold up to scientific scrutiny as far as consciousness is concerned. The criteria that have been scientifically vetted (based on information theory among other…
>The idea that animals are not conscious comes from religion, not science.
and even then: opinions, as they say, vary wildly.
Re: Conscious Perception Of Vision Occurs Outside The Visual Cortex
#10Earlier quoted context omitted.
The idea that animals are not conscious comes from religion, not science. The only conscious entity that I’m 100% positive exists is myself. If you reject solipsism, none of the traditional criteria that tell apart humans from animals (e.g. language or ethics) hold up to scientific scrutiny as far as consciousness is concerned. The criteria that have been scientifically vetted (based on information theory among other…
While you are right that we can't exclude the possibility of animals being consciousness, it's well accepted that their conscious level is very low compared to ours.
Is there some neuroscience backing that? Or is this an argument that consciousness is largely based on having language? Which sounds rather anthropomorphic.