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Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

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Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#211

Post by lsc »

inevitable. After spending the last year or two without a car at all, in part 'cause lyft and uber had started subtly raising prices, I bought a car a few months back.

I mean, I was a little sad, it was really really nice being driven everywhere... but fundamentally, I'm not quite rich enough to pay market-clearing prices to get driven everywhere. My own impression was that for the last few years, softbank has been subsidizing my own luxury rides, which was really nice! but it was also obviously not sustainable.

my own observation all along was that a lot of the price variation was "specials" - it used to be I could count on some discount several times a week. the biggest price increase I experienced, the one that pushed me to buy my own car, was seeing fewer of these.

Interestingly, now that I have a car and only use uber/lyft when drinking or otherwise away from a car, I get more discounts and specials again.

From talking to drivers, it's similar for them; a significant amount of their income consists of specials, for doing X drives in Y time period.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#213

Post by brianwawok »

denimnerd42 wrote: post #182
Spooky23 wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s where the invisible hand comes in and having functional markets matters. The difficulty in sustainably operating is also a demonstration of why heavily regulated taxis existed. When I had my roof replaced, estimates ranged from $12,000 to $75,000. We got 11 bids and paid $14k. That’s market forces at work, but also an example of a market without high capital costs.

those probably weren't all the same product though? like impact resistance shingles with an air gapped radiant barrier layed down with a ventilated roof line and all that fancy stuff is certainly going to cost more than generic shingles over tar paper.

My bids on my roof were 6k to 54k.

The 54k bid included a whole house energy audit with positive pressure tests and some stupid stuff. The bids from 6k to 32k were for the same literal shingles (architectural ) with the same installation and the same tear off and the same warranty.

The one pattern I noticed was the bids over 25k showed me a video with company values. (One talked about how Christian the owners were) The bids under 25k I got like a 5 minute explanation and a chance to ask questions.

Think I spent like 7k on the roof and it’s great.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#214

Post by clairity »

stereolambda wrote: post #202
clairity wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you're grossly underestimating the absolute ingenuity of 7-10 billion people jostling against each other for status. even if people were taxed such that net income was exactly the same for everyone, higher earners would still try to claim superior status from it. and that theoretical limit of perfect, simultaneous, accurate information is akin to the heat death of the universe, and really not worth practical (as oppo…

I dunno, the status appeal of money is very much what you can buy with it. I can technically imagine stores both online (good old tracking) and brick-and-mortar (looking at clothing and subtle body cues: inferring health, psychical well-being etc. - if not matching to external data with facial recognition) being able to quote, with machine learning, higher prices for you at check-out if your financial situation is be…

the rich person would just hire poor people to buy their trivial consumption items for them, both to get better prices and to put downward pressure on the practice. that's not even a particularly ingenious solution, but that's the kind of thing i mean by underestimating our collective ingenuity.

the transactional value of money is not inconsequential, but people absolutely do all kinds of (silly) things for status (see social media), moreso than just for transactional value.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#215

Post by leetcrew »

Barrin92 wrote: post #89
admn2 wrote: post #19

Pretty crazy with Juul, WeWork, DoorDash, and Uber / Lyft all struggling (or showing their true colors) that all the things they sought to kill are coming back. Taxis, cigarettes, picking up your own food! It's amazing to me that people were having food delivered from a half mile away.

>Pretty crazy with Juul, WeWork, DoorDash, and Uber / Lyft all struggling Given that the entire value-added of a company like Uber is getting a taxi to you slightly faster it's not surprising at all. Uber didn't make cars cheaper, drivers faster or added productivity in any other way plus they have a gigantic and expensive tech overhead, so it was never at all clear to me how they're supposed to be both competitive a…

the value add of uber is that you can use your phone's GPS and a map to tell someone where to pick you up instead of calling up the taxi company and describing where you are. I know taxi companies are starting to implement this stuff, but they didn't seem to be in a big hurry to do it before uber/lyft showed up. I haven't tried in a while, but I bet the smaller cab companies still don't have anything like this.

even if their value add is just getting a driver to me a little faster, this isn't nothing. the difference between a five minute and a ten minute expected wait isn't just five minutes of wasted time; at the margin, it's whether the customer decides to purchase a ride at all.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#216

Post by bsder »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #175
victor9000 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is why you should get wage quotes over the phone.

People smart enough to price discriminate won’t give quotes that easily.

Then I don't do business with them.

Seriously, auto dealers STILL try to do this and it pissed me off to no end the last time I had to buy a car.

Except one company. I sent in what I wanted on email. They sent back the quotes on 3 cars in stock. The quotes were all reasonable and slightly below the average. I went in and bought the car.

Since then, seven other people in my social circle bought from the same auto dealer the same way. Sure, individual salesmen aren't making commissions, but that dealer is up probably up $25K in profit for roughly 15 hours mostly spent signing paperwork (it takes 2 hours just signing and signing for all the paperwork even if you walk in with financing).

Attempting to "size me up" is almost always a good way to "piss me off".

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#217

Post by guptaneil »

leetcrew wrote: post #170
input_sh wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, because it's really fair for both a billionaire and someone living on 40k a year to pay the same price (let's say 2k) for a speeding ticket. Both of those people will be impacted accordingly I'm sure.

there are less than three thousand billionaires in the whole world. they could all drive like it was a formula 1 grand prix 24/7 and it would create a barely measurable blip in traffic fatalities. somewhere between ten and fifteen percent of americans are driving without insurance. I'm a lot more worried about them than the one lambo I see every couple months.

There's only one driver with the HN username guptaneil in the whole world. I could drive like a maniac and I would barely create a measurable blip in traffic fatalities.

Where do I sign up to be exempted from traffic fines, since my driving doesn't have any impact anyway?

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#218

Post by mpweiher »

ikeboy wrote: post #151
nannal wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? If I'm a poor speeding Fin, then a non-scaled speeding ticket could cost me a good number of days food. If I'm a rich speeding Fin then a non-scaled ticket is just the cost to travel quickly. When you're wealthy enough fines don't matter there's no point in the police enforcing them aside from as an additional income stream.

Speeding has a constant negative effect on society. It doesn't vary based on how wealthy the speeder is. Therefore, if the rate is higher for some people, it's either insufficiently disincentivizing poorer people from speeding, or excessively disincentivizing richer people. Pigovian taxes should be constant. And if it's not pigovian, why give tickets at all?

> It doesn't vary based on how wealthy the speeder is...Pigovian taxes should be constant.

Speeding is not a market activity and a speeding ticket is not a tax. Speeding is either a misdemeanour or crime, that means it is simply prohibited. Period.

The state of affairs you refer to, where the speeding ticket is considered just a cost of doing said activity is exactly what we want to avoid, and income-based speeding tickets are one mechanism that does this.

The purpose of a speeding ticket is to (a) punish and (b) deter. Both essentially don't work on rich people if they are too low, as you amply demonstrated, because they will consider this just a tax or similar minor nuisance. On the other hand, the fine that would actually deter a rich person from speeding might bankrupt a less wealthy individual and would therefore be disproportionately heavy.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#219

Post by leetcrew »

ghaff wrote: post #68
sokoloff wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uber/Lyft offer an option for someone who is already carrying the fixed costs of owning a depreciating vehicle to come into the market part-time and do some driving for income. They also don't have to commit to set hours. These should have the effect of increasing the supply of drivers (not to the full extent of all ride-share drivers, of course). They also don't have to front the capital cost of a medallion. Ride sh…

>already carrying the fixed costs of owning a depreciating vehicle Except depreciation and other costs are pretty heavily a function of miles rather than time. (Especially outside of the snow belt where the number of winters plays a big role in salt damage.) >They also don't have to front the capital cost of a medallion. That's true but how many places is that a big factor? We can argue the details and you're right t…

> Except depreciation and other costs are pretty heavily a function of miles rather than time.

this isn't really true of most mainstream cars. as long as people perceive the 2020 civic as an improvement over the 2019 model, a 2019 civic with zero miles will be worth less (you can verify this by visiting any dealership that still has the outgoing model in inventory). this is even more true of high-end cars until you get into stuff that's truly rare.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#220

Post by CaptainMarvel »

blhack wrote: post #146

Here’s how I wish Uber pricing worked: When I hail a ride, I say: I’m going from A to B and am willing to pay C (which Uber can recommend to me) for it. Now if nobody responds, I increase C until they do. This way the drivers know where they are going, how much I’m paying, etc. When a driver “accepts” a ride, I see their vehicle and rating, and get to choose from the people who have accepted. And on the other end, th…

That sounds good in theory, but it also sounds like a lot of effort!
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