Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over • Hacker News Board

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#151

Post by ikeboy » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 9:06 PM UTC

nannal wrote: post #84

suyash wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Finland traffic tickets sounds like a horrible idea.

Why? If I'm a poor speeding Fin, then a non-scaled speeding ticket could cost me a good number of days food. If I'm a rich speeding Fin then a non-scaled ticket is just the cost to travel quickly. When you're wealthy enough fines don't matter there's no point in the police enforcing them aside from as an additional income stream.

Speeding has a constant negative effect on society. It doesn't vary based on how wealthy the speeder is. Therefore, if the rate is higher for some people, it's either insufficiently disincentivizing poorer people from speeding, or excessively disincentivizing richer people.

Pigovian taxes should be constant. And if it's not pigovian, why give tickets at all?

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#152

Post by WalterBright » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 9:07 PM UTC

tmerr wrote: post #69

6gvONxR4sf7o wrote: post #31

> ...the company’s upcoming pricing algorithms, which they hinted might be able to more precisely predict what riders might be willing to pay for a ride. I hate the whole idea of this. If they track you around, maybe realize you order from fancy places on uber eats, then they will raise prices on something that costs them the same. There's something that strikes me as especially awful about automating the "how much i…

Knowing the max someone was willing to pay could help an actor set their prices optimally where there is no competition. Where there is competition, setting price to the max someone is willing to pay could drop overall profits since a competitor would happily undercut. So it does not change the rules of the game. Companies already price by predicting what people are willing to pay, by theory and experimentation. I wo…

> Companies already price by predicting what people are willing to pay

So does anyone else who is doing work. For example, have a contractor come by your home to give an estimate on roof repair. It'll be highly dependent on him sizing up you and what you can apparently afford.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#153

Post by enraged_camel » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 9:07 PM UTC

randyrand wrote: post #129

taytus wrote: post #128

The day cheap rides are over is the day that uber and lyft are over.

And walking everywhere will become the norm?

Most taxi companies were still in business the last time I checked.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#154

Post by cortesoft » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 9:07 PM UTC

save_ferris wrote: post #45

6gvONxR4sf7o wrote: post #31

> ...the company’s upcoming pricing algorithms, which they hinted might be able to more precisely predict what riders might be willing to pay for a ride. I hate the whole idea of this. If they track you around, maybe realize you order from fancy places on uber eats, then they will raise prices on something that costs them the same. There's something that strikes me as especially awful about automating the "how much i…

Couldn’t this technically qualify as discrimination? I vaguely remember reading about how one of the big dating apps increased prices with a user’s age, but had to revert the policy because it amounted to age discrimination. I would hope income qualifies for the same protection, but maybe not.

No, income is not a protected class. If you could show that the price discrimination unduly hurts a protected class, you might have a case, but that is unlikely.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#155

Post by grizzles » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 9:10 PM UTC

Solidarity. Noice. Didi / Ola are still subsidizing. I can't remember the exact pitch but an Uber driver pitched me the other day on a Didi deal to install the app that was insane.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#156

Post by OkGoDoIt » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 9:12 PM UTC

buckminster wrote: post #95

trimbo wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, do you own a nice house or car? If you do, you've already experienced this sizing-up. A contractor comes to the house and sees you can afford 2x what they'd normally charge. A mechanic for your Lexus charges N times as much as the same mechanic would for your Toyota, even though they're the same parts and manufacturer.

Similarly, the price of a venue or a band or a caterer is at least double if it's for a wedding.

When I was planning my San Francisco wedding, I told any supplier where it was feasible that I was having a family gathering, not a wedding.

(But the most important part of economically hosting a wedding is to not hire a wedding planner, it’s like their whole job is to separate you from your money. It’s a surprising amount of work to do everything yourself, but it’s the difference between a $5000 wedding and a $20,000 wedding)

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#157

Post by freyr » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 9:13 PM UTC

pen2l wrote: post #10

freyr wrote: post #2

The article was written back in August, so are we already seeing the higher prices?

> I've noticed this. I can reliably count on Uber/Lyft to price gouge me whenever they get the chance. Yeah but come on though, the cut the driver has to take, the cost of car maintenance, the cut Uber is entitled to for giving you a reliable service of connecting you to a driver (and co-pool-riders) and making this process smooth -- compare all of that with what a taxi used to cost, it's still pretty cheap in my opi…

(Sorry, I'd deleted the sentence you quoted right as you replied).

I don't mind them raising prices as is needed.

I'm complaining specifically about price gouging. For example, it cost me $8 to travel from my house to a bar the other night, to meet up with some friends. Then it started drizzling, and I had to pay $40 for the ride home.

I get that they're taking advantage of temporary increased demand, but it's not a good customer experience, and next time I'll arrange another way to travel.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#158

Post by OkGoDoIt » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 9:14 PM UTC

chewz wrote: post #111

6gvONxR4sf7o wrote: post #31

> ...the company’s upcoming pricing algorithms, which they hinted might be able to more precisely predict what riders might be willing to pay for a ride. I hate the whole idea of this. If they track you around, maybe realize you order from fancy places on uber eats, then they will raise prices on something that costs them the same. There's something that strikes me as especially awful about automating the "how much i…

> Yet another reason to advocate for privacy, Take a taxi, pay with cash. Private.

I agree in theory, but in practice taxis are significantly more expensive than even Uber. And you don’t know the price upfront. I don’t think I’ve ever had a taxi experience where I was happy with the value, at least in the USA.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#159

Post by dboreham » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 9:16 PM UTC

suyash wrote: post #77

blululu wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Discriminatory pricing feels nasty when you're get the short end of the stick but any pricing scheme will have bias. Having a high wage earner pay the same fare for a service as a low wage earner gives a much better deal to the wealthier person. (In Finland traffic tickets are calculated as a percentage of your income) In many countries you will pay a surcharge if merchants think that you are wealthier since it impli…

Finland traffic tickets sounds like a horrible idea.

UK had the same speeding ticket fine based on income years ago. Not sure if they still do.

Re: Uber and Lyft Suggest the Days of Cheap Rides Could Be Over

#160

Post by OkGoDoIt » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 9:17 PM UTC

save_ferris wrote: post #45

6gvONxR4sf7o wrote: post #31

> ...the company’s upcoming pricing algorithms, which they hinted might be able to more precisely predict what riders might be willing to pay for a ride. I hate the whole idea of this. If they track you around, maybe realize you order from fancy places on uber eats, then they will raise prices on something that costs them the same. There's something that strikes me as especially awful about automating the "how much i…

Couldn’t this technically qualify as discrimination? I vaguely remember reading about how one of the big dating apps increased prices with a user’s age, but had to revert the policy because it amounted to age discrimination. I would hope income qualifies for the same protection, but maybe not.

Tinder almost certainly still discriminates pricing based on age. A friend of mine signed up for two new accounts a couple months back and the account where he listed his age as in his 20s would have been half the price as for an upgrade subscription for the one where he was listed as being in his 30s.

Maybe they are using other factors, maybe he was in a different part of town when he signed up. Maybe it has to do with the school or the job listed in each account. You don’t know, and therefore you can’t prove anything. As long as the algorithms are a black box it’s hard to take a company to court over discrimination.