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What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?
131–140 of 244 posts
Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?
#132> We need to applaud companies like Slack, but know that the nitty-gritty of human services—housing, health care, social support—which lots of nonprofits and public institutions are working on, the private sector has largely turned away from.” I mean, yeah? Those things sound like they’re precisely the kind of stuff that’s the domain of non-profits and the government. Why would we expect Slack or other tech companies…
You're effectively describing trickle-down economics. "Help out rich people so they pay more taxes which will trickle down to poor people" That's not a real thing. The economy is trickle-up. Income inequality is widening. San francisco has the worst income inequality of any city in a developed country: top 1% earn 44x more than bottom 99%. The number of home owners has actually decreased in the last ten years. Cost o…
I'm a social democrat. My point is that we shouldn't be dependent on the whims of private companies feeling charitable or not. If society needs money from them, then that's what taxes are for.
Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?
#133I love how inmates get a better education and more support from tech companies than the adults who live in the bay area. The bay area has the worst income inequality of anywhere in any developed country. Bootcamps are a scam and cost tens of thousands of dollars and yet inmates, people convicted of severe crimes, are treated to free education. From a business standpoint this makes more sense because inmates have no b…
I'm a bit unclear on your perspective here. Are you saying teaching inmates is wrong because they've apparently lost their chance at success in life because of their "severe crimes"?
Regardless of that perspective, here's a truth: most inmates will be released at some point. As a matter of fact, alot of the inequality you reference is a result of those with criminal backgrounds and the socioeconomic conditions that got them those backgrounds. We have a rich set of statistics about what happens to people in that situation: desperation -> crime -> prison -> repeat. Personally I don't like that world. I want to feel safe in my world, and anything we can do to short-circuit that recidivism cycle makes us all safer.
The "but our jobs! but our pay!" refrain is a common one, but our industry has WAY too many job openings for this to be a legit worry (the very presence of the h1b visa proves this). As for salary, as those jobs get filled, whether by bootcamp grads, or journeymen, or trained individuals with a criminal record - it will push income down for some. Some incomes are a product of scarcity, and you only need to look at a supply/demand curve to know what will happen to prices. In the late 90s, you'd spend tens of thousands of dollars to get a basic website. Now you can get one for a few hundred.
Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?
#134Earlier quoted context omitted.
The UK has just had an election where many people voted for the party which has been in power for nearly ten years and been an utter disaster. Because they want change. Condescension has nothing to do with it. It's empirically observable that a proportion of the electorate doesn't vote in its own best interests. It's also empirically observable there's an entire industry of media outlets, think-tanks, journalists, bl…
The 2019 election - just like the previous 3, subverted the popular vote by way of First Past the Post. Nationally, the pro-leave side only secured a minority of the vote. And unfortunately a major problem with proportional representation is there's no one single best way to achieve PR - any campaign to achieve PR would be stymied by splitting the pro-PR faction between STV and IRV, for example.
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Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?
#135How would, " What happens after prisoners become accountants / lawyers / bankers... " sound? To me, it says that trust in our profession is interchangeable with that of trained felons. I'd rather not have technically proficient felons near passwords, credit card #s, and other personal information. Edit: I hate to sound like a Calvinist here, but you have to ask yourself how much a change in behavior is due to "rehabi…
> I'd rather not have technically proficient felons near passwords, credit card #s, and other personal information Isn't a felon's debt to society meant to be repaid after their sentence ends? I'd much rather that people leave prison ready to be useful and/or productive members of society.
Trust has to be earned--even for non-felons. After the debt is paid, I think that puts the balance at zero.
How many tech firms hire at zero--other than in situations like this limited-time virtue signaling / PR fodder opportunity?
Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?
#136> We need to applaud companies like Slack, but know that the nitty-gritty of human services—housing, health care, social support—which lots of nonprofits and public institutions are working on, the private sector has largely turned away from.” I mean, yeah? Those things sound like they’re precisely the kind of stuff that’s the domain of non-profits and the government. Why would we expect Slack or other tech companies…
> blaming Slack and co. is silly. It’s not their job, and it shouldn’t be: you don’t want the institutions with profit motive to be the ones handling charitable works. I’d agree with what you said because the reason you gave seems strong & compelling to me; the idea that profit motive might corrupt charity if in charge. On the other hand, I dislike the idea that only government should “handle” social responsibility.…
CSR is fine and good when you're talking about behaving in an ethical manner in the course of their business. But there isn't really any reason to want Slack and co in charge of solving housing or health care. It's not their responsibility, it's not their expertise. Expecting every single company to be randomly contributing to a dozen different societal problems outside the scope of their business is a recipe for scatterbrained failure.
Like, what even would Slack be expected to do here for housing or health care? Slack can't change zoning regulations. They can't force hospitals to provide price transparency. Why expect them to do something, rather than just take their money and have the government do something with it, when the government has vastly more authority to act?
Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?
#137I mean at the end of the day this is just a way to get cheap labor.
The "but our jobs! but our pay!" refrain is a common one, but our industry has WAY too many job openings for this to be a legit worry (the very presence of the h1b visa proves this). As for salary, as those jobs get filled, whether by bootcamp grads, or journeymen, or trained individuals with a criminal record - it will push income down for some. Some incomes are a product of scarcity, and you only need to look at a supply/demand curve to know what will happen to prices. In the late 90s, you'd spend tens of thousands of dollars to get a basic website. Now you can get one for a few hundred.
Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?
#138Earlier quoted context omitted.
Your logical error is assuming that it’s so obvious what “vot[ing] against [one’s] own interests” means. Maybe a stable free market government with a strong cultural and religious framework is in everyone’s interest, and the “massive industry” exists to convince people of that fact?
This was like the archetype of a partisan argument. You two managed to go through why the sides don't like each other's worldview or the way it's expressed, and then stopped the second it came to discussing any real world issues. And I mean both of you as well, you could've given examples and data about why your system might be in anyone's interest but you didn't and it would've been the perfect time for him to reply…
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Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?
#139Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I'd rather not have technically proficient felons near passwords, credit card #s, and other personal information Isn't a felon's debt to society meant to be repaid after their sentence ends? I'd much rather that people leave prison ready to be useful and/or productive members of society.
Trust has to be earned--even for non-felons. After the debt is paid, I think that puts the balance at zero. How many tech firms hire at zero--other than in situations like this limited-time virtue signaling / PR fodder opportunity?
> Trust has to be earned--even for non-felons
Yet we hire kids straight out of college or a bootcamp and give them access to production data.
Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?
#140Earlier quoted context omitted.
If you look at the 1997 Labour manifesto, which led to the UK doubling GDP from 97 to and 2007 and the 2019 Labour manifesto they’re very similar. If you ask people if Labour was good for the economy and would be good for the economy, you’ll largely get a negative response. Unfortunately it’s easy for people’s opinions to be shaped with zero basis in fact and when this happens it’s easy for them to vote against their…
If you look at the 1997 Labour manifesto, which led to the UK doubling GDP from 97 to and 2007 and the 2019 Labour manifesto they’re very similar The bits about nationalising everything were certainly very different so I don’t think this claim holds up to scrutiny. I also find it interesting that you stop at 2007. What happened in 2008 that might call into doubt Labour’s management of the economy?
You're blaming Labour for an international financial crisis?