What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code? • Hacker News Board

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#91

Post by golemotron » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 3:24 PM UTC

TulliusCicero wrote: post #2

> We need to applaud companies like Slack, but know that the nitty-gritty of human services—housing, health care, social support—which lots of nonprofits and public institutions are working on, the private sector has largely turned away from.” I mean, yeah? Those things sound like they’re precisely the kind of stuff that’s the domain of non-profits and the government. Why would we expect Slack or other tech companies…

> I mean, yeah? Those things sound like they’re precisely the kind of stuff that’s the domain of non-profits and the government. Why would we expect Slack or other tech companies to be helping random people with housing or social support?

The economy is becoming more competitive in the upper 20%. This translates into heightened signaling around social issues for those in that bracket [1]. It's not a bad thing, and people do have their hearts in the right place, but the underlying status anxiety is real and it is an economic effect.

[1] https://americanaffairsjournal.org/2019/11/the-real-class-wa...

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#92

Post by EricE » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 3:24 PM UTC

harimau777 wrote: post #59

lizardking wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don’t need to convince republicans, you need to convince moderates who can be persuaded to vote one way or the other in a given election. In the context of a general election, we’re talking about thousands of people in a handful of states. I’m struggling with how the idea of “condescension isn’t persuasive” is finding so much friction here.

The issue that I see is that due to the electoral college and gerrymandering, it can be difficult to win even if you can convince moderates. The other issue is that many of the issues that progressives are concerned about (e.g. climate change, inequality, gun control) require action by society as a whole. Ideally we would negotiate and find policies that address the priorities of both progressives and conservatives.…

> The issue that I see is that due to the electoral college

Please read the federalist papers.

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#93

Post by burfog » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 3:24 PM UTC

harimau777 wrote: post #40

lizardking wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The American political left would gain immensely and lose exactly nothing by being less condescending. The first line of argument they should abandon is telling people they are voting against their own interests. It’s remarkably insulting, and arrogantly presupposes you know know better what another person’s interests are.

I'm not sure that a better solution is possible in America's current political climate. As I see it there are basically three approaches that a progressive could take in a policy debate: - Persuasion: I think that you are mistaken as to what is in your best interest, here's why my approach would benefit you more. - Negotiation: Here's how we can work together to find a solution that meets both of our interests. - Zer…

About that "promoting polarization", it takes two to polarize. You too have the option to cave. You are free to end the polarization at any moment.

Demonizing the other size is impressively the other way. It's happening whenever you see people flinging words like racist, sexist, fascist, and nazi.

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#94

Post by lizardking » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 3:25 PM UTC

learnstats2 wrote: post #47

lizardking wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The American political left would gain immensely and lose exactly nothing by being less condescending. The first line of argument they should abandon is telling people they are voting against their own interests. It’s remarkably insulting, and arrogantly presupposes you know know better what another person’s interests are.

Do the American political right not constantly say the same thing? But face less scrutiny when they say it.

Failure to scrutinize your performance when you are losing is a recipe for more losing.

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#95

Post by bipolar_lisper » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 3:25 PM UTC

I mean at the end of the day this is just a way to get cheap labor.

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#96

Post by sokoloff » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 3:27 PM UTC

jstewartmobile wrote: post #81

How would, " What happens after prisoners become accountants / lawyers / bankers... " sound? To me, it says that trust in our profession is interchangeable with that of trained felons. I'd rather not have technically proficient felons near passwords, credit card #s, and other personal information. Edit: I hate to sound like a Calvinist here, but you have to ask yourself how much a change in behavior is due to "rehabi…

The specific felony matters a lot to me. Someone busted with a gram of marijuana or a bong in Arizona can pick up a felony conviction for it. Someone with a previous embezzlement charge is a different story (even if the embezzlement conviction was only a misdemeanor).

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#97

Post by jayparth » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 3:28 PM UTC

purple_ducks wrote: post #9

I'm all for the positivity but really?? > Access to an elite organization In what way is Slack elite? These writers need to tone done their hyperbole.

In what way is Slack not elite? Slack is within the top 10% of companies in the Bay Area by pretty much any metric you choose to rank companies by. By almost any measure, that's elite.

Is Berkeley not an elite school, because it's less prestigious than Stanford?

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#98

Post by danso » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 3:31 PM UTC

> * Drew McGahey, the engineering manager at Slack for all three apprentices, was initially struck by their ability to solve what he called “blank-canvas problems”—those that don’t have prescribed solutions. “Thinking back to their experience, it makes a lot of sense,” he said. “They all learned how to code in an environment where they didn’t have access to the internet. They’ve got drive.”*

Anyone familiar with contemporary interviews have insight/examples on what “blank-canvas” problems are?

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#99

Post by abnry » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 3:32 PM UTC

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #67

abnry wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are missing the point. If I say, "I support X" and you say, "I support not X," that's just a disagreement. If I say, "I support" and you say, "I support not X, and if you weren't so blind you'd think that too," that's being condescending because you are assuming that someone (a) has fundamentally the same values than you but is (b) too stupid to see it. The reality is that people can value something different tha…

>people can value something different than you (less government intervention, less restrictions on speech, lower taxes) for fundamental reasons different than yours // You're right, but in the election run-up people living on minimum wage, who complained we needed a change because of the rich getting too rich, also were convinced that Labour's tax increases were a devastating blow to them personally; tax increases th…

Right, but there is a massive difference between saying that some people can be misled and categorizing an entire political party as a bunch of fools.

(As an aside, it is entirely fair to question your future tax rates under a politician promising to deliver massive social programs, even if they don't claim they'll raise taxes for the non-rich. Money has to come from somewhere and there's no guarantee that taxing "the rich" is going to be enough.

Also, saying "They also don't appear to realise taxes pay for running the country" is a strikingly dim-view to have of people.)

As another person said, the real interests are not always monetary. Someone may be willing to pay more in healthcare if the government is less involved in their life, even if they are poorer than most people. This is just one example.

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#100

Post by danso » Sat, Dec 14, 2019, 3:32 PM UTC

jstewartmobile wrote: post #81

How would, " What happens after prisoners become accountants / lawyers / bankers... " sound? To me, it says that trust in our profession is interchangeable with that of trained felons. I'd rather not have technically proficient felons near passwords, credit card #s, and other personal information. Edit: I hate to sound like a Calvinist here, but you have to ask yourself how much a change in behavior is due to "rehabi…

The article says the felon coders who were hired are in the test engineering department, due to restrictions clients have when it comes to data access by people with criminal records.

And those with criminal records are allowed to practice law. Quite a few inspirational stories of this actually: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shon_Hopwood