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Self-driving truck delivers butter from California to Pennsylvania in three days

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Re: Self-driving truck delivers butter from California to Pennsylvania in three days

#171

Post by WallStUrinal »

bagacrap wrote: post #158
duelingjello wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We need to create lots of jobs in other industries that allow living wages without a college degree. The government should massively incentivize: - solar farms - wind turbines - battery storage deployments - residential solar w/ batteries and grid-down operation (most grid-tied virtual battery solar stops working completely in a power outage) - achieve fusion power net output - elderly and disabled caregivers - offer…

These don't sound like drop in replacements for truck driving. A truck driver might not be able-bodied enough to install solar panels, might not be willing to take the pay cut or move to a new state where the job is.

$1,000/mo isn't a drop in replacement for trucking either, is it?

Re: Self-driving truck delivers butter from California to Pennsylvania in three days

#172

Post by larnmar »

pm90 wrote: post #102
larnmar wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Truck driving is not and has never been a middle-class occupation.

False. Truck driving is one of the few steady jobs that remain middle class https://www.bls.gov/ooh/transportation-and-material-moving/m...

You think $44K is a middle-class income?

Re: Self-driving truck delivers butter from California to Pennsylvania in three days

#173

Post by ravar »

orbifold wrote: post #121
k_bx wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's interesting is that it seems that there's already a shortage of truck drivers out there, so it's not only displacement, but also filling of jobs which don't have enough people willing to take https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-07-24/u-s-truck...

Shortage of a certain type of labor is just an indicator that it doesn’t pay enough. I’ve also got a shortage of Tesla in my garage.

Tesla cars are probably the only thing you could have picked to not show that point. They can’t make cars fast enough despite charging crazy prices.

Re: Self-driving truck delivers butter from California to Pennsylvania in three days

#174

Post by novok »

onion2k wrote: post #126
pwagland wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That just means that it doesn't pay enough though. Imagine this thought experiment, if you could make 1,000,000USD a year from being a truck driver, would you do it? Even if that job only has a 3-4 year lifespan? I suspect that most people would. Obviously 1,000,000 is _too much_, but conversely whatever the current rate is, is probably too low.

You're looking at the pay in isolation from other career options. Imagine you're 25 and looking for something long term. Do you do trucking knowing that it won't last and you'll have to change to something else later, or do you look for a different career instead? Everyone who thinks it through will choose something else. The current level of pay is attractive to truckers moving to other companies, but it's not much…

I'd do a 2-4 year stint and with all of my extra savings from being paid $4 million use it to train for some other career I might enjoy better.

Re: Self-driving truck delivers butter from California to Pennsylvania in three days

#175

Post by robomartin »

bagacrap wrote: post #159
robomartin wrote: post #138

Sorry to pour cold butter on this... This is not at all what we want. We need to build an automated electric high speed cargo rail system connecting the coasts and major ports. The system has to have the ability for individual container units to be routed independently. Nothing would compare to moving cargo at 300 mph or more on an efficient rail system. We need trucking to be local or short range and eliminate indiv…

Nothing except moving the cargo at 50 or 100mph. A shipping container moving 300mph at ground level is going to encounter some insane wind resistance even if you do attach fairings.

Seriously? Look up TGV and imagine the cars have containers inside. Not that difficult. Far more efficient than trucks.

And then there’s Hyperloop.

Re: Self-driving truck delivers butter from California to Pennsylvania in three days

#176

Post by woodandsteel »

oarsinsync wrote: post #128
onion2k wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're looking at the pay in isolation from other career options. Imagine you're 25 and looking for something long term. Do you do trucking knowing that it won't last and you'll have to change to something else later, or do you look for a different career instead? Everyone who thinks it through will choose something else. The current level of pay is attractive to truckers moving to other companies, but it's not much…

If I was 25 and offered $1,000,000/year for 2 years as a trucker, or $100,000 as a code monkey, I'd take the trucking job. It helps that I have the benefit of hindsight having only started my career in IT at 27, and done all sorts of other stuff before then, none of which had any long term prospects, nor did it pay $1MM/year.

Truck companies can't afford to pay $1,000,000 a year because the industry is too competitive, which keeps the fees trucking companies low.

What is basically happening is the trucking companies are living with a shortage of drivers, and waiting for self-driving to arrive.

Re: Self-driving truck delivers butter from California to Pennsylvania in three days

#177

Post by einpoklum »

duelingjello wrote: post #93
Tempest1981 wrote: post #59

For better or worse, millions of truck drivers are going to be displaced. Just like the way robots replaced manufacturing jobs. The best plan is to prepare, like Yang and others are saying: https://www.yang2020.com/policies/trucking-czar/ So we can soften the blow.

We need to create lots of jobs in other industries that allow living wages without a college degree. The government should massively incentivize: - solar farms - wind turbines - battery storage deployments - residential solar w/ batteries and grid-down operation (most grid-tied virtual battery solar stops working completely in a power outage) - achieve fusion power net output - elderly and disabled caregivers - offer…

"need to create lots of jobs etc."

Why? Is there something you're missing that requires a lot more workers?

The assumption that people need to be fit into "jobs" is, well, a salaried employment fetish; or the moral assumption that if you don't work a job you don't deserve goods and services.

Now, it's true that there actually is a whole lot of work in setting up and distributing alternative energy devices and infrasturcture. But overall, a lot of human labor is becoming redundant with automation, and there aren't "more jobs than people". Getting people to artificially create businesses as an alternative to salaried employment is also no solution.

PS - "At globally-competitive prices" = "Make workers compete with sweatshop pseudo-slave-labor in other countries, thus ensuring their own poverty and overwork."

Re: Self-driving truck delivers butter from California to Pennsylvania in three days

#178

Post by JohnClark1337 »

I could be wrong but I think a good initial phase would be to have some kind of station at the edge of cities where human drivers can jump in and take over for navigating within cities for pickup and dropoff, and then getting out and letting the AI drive the long-haul.
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