Do the retailers actually pay the fees? I always assumed that this is pushed into the price to the consumer.
Retailers Don’t Like Paying the Fees for Apple Card
21–30 of 102 posts
Re: Retailers Don’t Like Paying the Fees for Apple Card
#22I'm incredibly naive but I don't understand why card networks would ever WANT to raise their percentage rates... Hear me out:
- It is perfect rent collecting: minimal costs, benefits hugely from scale, high barrier for competitor entry. You're an "invisible" profit center, if done right.
- It is percentage of transaction: So increases naturally with inflation and your client's success. Loses little on your client's failures.
But instead of just sitting on their hands and raking in their 6% basically forever, they're inflating the percentage which is causing disgruntled clients to look elsewhere and to give a gap where competition can enter.
This is one industry where "boring is king." But it seems like greed may result in legislative or competitive market correction if they keep engaging in these practices.
Re: Retailers Don’t Like Paying the Fees for Apple Card
#23Note that back in November, @DHH from Basecamp had strong words about the Apple Card with regards to sexism. I know there's active investigations going on with it, but I know of no results. Then again, it's just been 1 month, which is pretty much 'yesterday' in bank time. https://twitter.com/dhh/status/1192540900393705474
I have no opinions about DHH in general, but he's just wrong here. He tweets: > Hilarious how much mansplaining is flowing in this thread. Every single poster questioning my wife’s credit score, a man. Every single defense of Apple blaming GS, a man. Almost like men are over represented in the defense/justification of discrimination that doesn’t affect them? which immediately costs him all credibility in this specifi…
> He still doesn't mention their relative income.
Because it doesn't matter. As of 2013, you enter combined household income on a credit application, and your income isn't part of your credit score either.
Re: Retailers Don’t Like Paying the Fees for Apple Card
#24> “It’s almost like an arms race of who can offer the most rewards,” says Chris Ligan, vice president for acquisitions at Auric, which has seen use of premium cards climb 7% this year. “The person stuck with the bill is the merchant.” And they pass it on to us.
Maybe smaller places that can't absorb the merchant fees as easily, but big retail places don't usually charge more for using certain credit cards. It'd probably cost them a chunk of business if they did.
I think what the parent commenter was trying to say is that merchants raise prices on everything, whether you pay with card or cash, to offset credit card fees. What ends up happening is that customers that pay cash are paying for the rewards I get by using a credit card.
Re: Retailers Don’t Like Paying the Fees for Apple Card
#25Note that back in November, @DHH from Basecamp had strong words about the Apple Card with regards to sexism. I know there's active investigations going on with it, but I know of no results. Then again, it's just been 1 month, which is pretty much 'yesterday' in bank time. https://twitter.com/dhh/status/1192540900393705474
I have no opinions about DHH in general, but he's just wrong here. He tweets: > Hilarious how much mansplaining is flowing in this thread. Every single poster questioning my wife’s credit score, a man. Every single defense of Apple blaming GS, a man. Almost like men are over represented in the defense/justification of discrimination that doesn’t affect them? which immediately costs him all credibility in this specifi…
The allegations (made by quite a few people, not just one) were that Apple was turning down/giving worse terms to women that had better income/credit scores than their husbands.
Re: Retailers Don’t Like Paying the Fees for Apple Card
#26If the card issuer can decide the fee, why don't all cards charge the max fee?
Re: Retailers Don’t Like Paying the Fees for Apple Card
#27This system is completely convoluted, with the incentives all over the place between merchant, bank, CC processor, consumer. It's the kind of thing that will never change until you go to a different country or start an alternative payment system that is 10x better, because no one has the power or will to displace the existing infrastructure. Consumers don't care because they don't (directly) pay the bill for these be…
What do other countries do?
Re: Retailers Don’t Like Paying the Fees for Apple Card
#28The whole existence of credit card rewards seems like a failure of the system. Since merchants agree not to charge more to high fee credit card customers, all the other customers end up paying the fees for those rewards. So everyone has to use a credit card with rewards to compensate for that loss and the ultimate losers are the suckers who pay with cash or whatever else.
I refuse to play those games and it surely costs me, but at least I don't have to deal with any of the stupid paperwork and multiple cards in my wallet and keep track of how much pocket money some pointless company is going to give me.
Re: Retailers Don’t Like Paying the Fees for Apple Card
#29> “It’s almost like an arms race of who can offer the most rewards,” says Chris Ligan, vice president for acquisitions at Auric, which has seen use of premium cards climb 7% this year. “The person stuck with the bill is the merchant.” And they pass it on to us.
I've always thought this fee + cashback thing is weird, because the merchants just add it back to the cost of the item. Sure, you may be getting that cost back as cash, but the merchant charges you the same if you don't have the super elite card. So isn't this just a sneaky underhanded way to tax the poor which obviously don't have credit to get the super elite card?
Re: Retailers Don’t Like Paying the Fees for Apple Card
#30This system is completely convoluted, with the incentives all over the place between merchant, bank, CC processor, consumer. It's the kind of thing that will never change until you go to a different country or start an alternative payment system that is 10x better, because no one has the power or will to displace the existing infrastructure. Consumers don't care because they don't (directly) pay the bill for these be…
What do other countries do?
Regulate interchange fees (or use regulatory enforcement threats to obtain concessions from natural financial monopolies).
https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/IP_19_...
Control-F "The Commitments"
In the US, debit card fees are regulated (the Fed won it's case in 2015 at the Supreme Court regarding this), but not credit card interchange fees.