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Why Child Care Is So Expensive

theatlantic.com

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Re: Why Child Care Is So Expensive

#91

Post by glofish »

ngngngng wrote: post #58
ecoled_ame wrote: post #23

I'm glad the population is mind-bogglingly large so I don't feel obligated to have kids. I can save a lot of money and enjoy peace & quiet while I get better at skateboarding and science and playing video games. Plus, no wife. I never have to do things I don't want to. I never have to please anybody. It rocks.

You should feel obligated. I believe your opinion is similar to climate change denial since all the experts on the subject disagree with you.

don't badger the man,

the world (and Earth) is much better off with fewer people,

it is called quorum-sensing in science, many organisms stop reproducing then they overpopulate, humanity should do the same, if it is a philosophy that is followed, so much better, everyone is better off

Re: Why Child Care Is So Expensive

#92

Post by Dobbs »

ChaosDegenerate wrote: post #39
cortesoft wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would be very careful about making that large a generalization (that all else being equal, women would prefer to stay home over working). Childcare is mind numbing work, especially with young kids. Sure, some women (and men) would prefer that, but a LOT of women prefer office work over raising children. "why not to enjoy life instead of spending 50-60 hours at the office?" is really selling short how much work rais…

well, somehow the society at large has no problem with exactly opposite generalization: that women prefer to work over staying home with their kids. It is an individual matter, I agree. With most women definitely having the preference of staying at home. But for that the right partner is needed, i.e. one who provides enough resources for her and her kids. If this is not present she will go to work. We decided as a so…

> I'm sorry but this is just how it works

No this is not how any of it works. This is extremly sexist, and has no evidence to support it.

Re: Why Child Care Is So Expensive

#93

Post by wklauss »

vturner wrote: post #21

This may be somewhat off-topic, but I'm often surprised that leftist policies like the article advocates are often proposed at a national level? Why is this? Why not propose a state-sponsored child-care system in a leftist state - California, Washington, Massachusetts, etc. I'm not trying to start a war here, simply genuinely interested why people on the left push national social programs versus propose them in very…

They are, even at a more local level. New York City, for example, has a free pre-k (4yo) program. But in order to be effective, some of these policies need to be applied nationwide. In other cases, state budgets are simply too constrained for them. Like someone said in the comments, this is a program that could paid itself with the income tax from both parents working, but in the US the majority of income tax goes to the federal government, I think.

Re: Why Child Care Is So Expensive

#94

Post by bachmeier »

jawns wrote: post #60
cortesoft wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would be very careful about making that large a generalization (that all else being equal, women would prefer to stay home over working). Childcare is mind numbing work, especially with young kids. Sure, some women (and men) would prefer that, but a LOT of women prefer office work over raising children. "why not to enjoy life instead of spending 50-60 hours at the office?" is really selling short how much work rais…

> Childcare is mind numbing work > It is NOT enjoying life to stay home with toddlers. > I was so happy to be able to go back to work > the weekends are way more stressful than the weekdays I have to say, this kind of perspective on being a parent puzzles me, even though it's pretty widely held. Honestly, many parents I encounter seem almost as if they'd prefer to be their child's aunt or uncle than their mom or dad.…

> the sense of purpose I feel about teaching my child about the alphabet

I don't think that's what parents find difficult. It's the other 99.9% of being a parent.

Re: Why Child Care Is So Expensive

#95

Post by maerF0x0 »

cortesoft wrote: post #18
ChaosDegenerate wrote: post #6

The thing with female workforce participation: isn't it just symptom of the society getting poorer. My wife worked her ass off. I was making about 130k / year. She was making about 60k / year. Then we not only moved from the US to Poland (where live is just so much cheaper). But I also started making about 330k / year. All the willingness to work evaporated on her part :-) Instead we have another kid. She stopped tal…

I would be very careful about making that large a generalization (that all else being equal, women would prefer to stay home over working). Childcare is mind numbing work, especially with young kids. Sure, some women (and men) would prefer that, but a LOT of women prefer office work over raising children. "why not to enjoy life instead of spending 50-60 hours at the office?" is really selling short how much work rais…

> I would be very careful about making that large a generalization (that all else being equal, women would prefer to stay home over working).

The conversation I rarely see people having is wether a people group (men or women, for example) has a long term positive/regret recollection of the choice. I understand that most of the messaging today is that women can (and should) pursue paid employment and so naturally that becomes the narrative that people repeat. But 30 yrs later do women generally regret entering the workforce to the detriment of having / raising children? Anecdotally I know many men regret spending so much time at work and not being more involved in their children's lives, could it also hold true for women?

Re: Why Child Care Is So Expensive

#96

Post by bluedino »

PaulHoule wrote: post #10
tick_tock_tick wrote: post #2

Women's introduction to the workforce was the right thing to happen but it fundamentally hurt labor and the "middle class". You can't double the supply without changing anything in the system and inflationary effects of dual income are ridiculous.

See this Liz Warren book: https://www.amazon.com/Two-Income-Trap-Middle-Class-Parents-... Henry Ford realized that the automobile was not going to change the world unless auto workers were so productive that they could easily afford the cars they made. That kind of productivity increase is not possible w/ Childcare. I remember a Z Magazine cartoon more than 20 years ago where two women were pondering the mystery of w…

In my state, a single childcare worker can watch up to 6 children. If they are infants I belive the number goes down to 4.

Re: Why Child Care Is So Expensive

#97

Post by myu701 »

ngngngng wrote: post #58
ecoled_ame wrote: post #23

I'm glad the population is mind-bogglingly large so I don't feel obligated to have kids. I can save a lot of money and enjoy peace & quiet while I get better at skateboarding and science and playing video games. Plus, no wife. I never have to do things I don't want to. I never have to please anybody. It rocks.

You should feel obligated. I believe your opinion is similar to climate change denial since all the experts on the subject disagree with you.

I'll bite.

Why should that user feel obligated to have children?

There are other users on this site (I'm not one of them) that argue that the world is suffering from overpopulation. I'm interested to hear your perspective as to why the opposite is not only okay, but imperative.

Re: Why Child Care Is So Expensive

#98

Post by WhompingWindows »

mkoryak wrote: post #22
FactolSarin wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think that's necessarily woman-specific. I'm a guy, and if I could stay at home all day and spend time with my kids, I would too. Certainly, I would if my wife was making 330k/year :D

wait, are you saying that staying at home with the kids is not work?! It is arguably a harder job than most white collar jobs out there: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MWcJZ210AaM

Unless parent edited their comment, sounds like you're way over-interpreting their comment. I wouldn't mind being a stay-at-home parent if my SO made bank, it's not because I think it'd be "not work" though.

Re: Why Child Care Is So Expensive

#99

Post by glofish »

ecoled_ame wrote: post #69
ngngngng wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should feel obligated. I believe your opinion is similar to climate change denial since all the experts on the subject disagree with you.

Sounds like extra work and and an unwanted nuisance to my life of leisure. Plus I love alone time, I could never live with a woman long enough to breed with her. Whenever I walk in public, all I can think is jeez ... there are so many random people. Seems like we need better planning. People just have kids on whim, to satisfy themselves, like a life goal. It doesn't make much sense to me. I think mostly ladies want c…

There is nothing wrong with not wanting kids. Makes sense.

That being said I would recommend toning down the rhetoric of how much better you're off for not having kids - it rings fake and forced as if you needed to convince yourself repeatedly and it is needlessly antagonistic.

The analogy is that of having a dog. I'd like to have a dog. I think it is fun to have a dog. Alas, dogs are not for me, they feel the kind of work and responsibility that I am not ready for. But I respect and admire people that have dogs! I am not going to say that I am so much better off for not having a dog.

Re: Why Child Care Is So Expensive

#100

Post by cortesoft »

ng12 wrote: post #49
cortesoft wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This doesn't make economic sense.... 'doubling supply' is what economic growth is.... producing more should be balanced out with people consuming more, which is what a healthy economy does. This is like arguing that the invention of the assembly line caused inflation because you could produce too much. You contradict yourself by saying 'double supply' and 'inflationary effects'... increasing supply of a commodity (in…

It makes perfect economic sense: it's a simple supply and demand curve. Increasing the number of workers decreases their value. The only confounding factor is whether the increase in workers increases the speed at which the economy grows/ I'd guess it probably does, but not enough to offset the downward pressure on wages.

It is pretty well accepted fact in economics that a growing workforce is a good thing for economic growth.

> it's a simple supply and demand curve. Increasing the number of workers decreases their value.

You are leaving out a crucial factor - the wages that the 'new' workers earn are going to be spent in the economy, growing the economy as a whole. This is increasing the 'demand' side of that supply and demand curve.

This is the same flaw that anti-immigrant people use when saying that immigrants 'take our jobs'. They take a job, but they also create jobs by spending the money they earn. That is what an economy is. Every worker creates more value than they take (otherwise no one would hire the worker in the first place!)

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