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Climate change and nutrient pollution are depleting oxygen from oceans: study

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Climate change and nutrient pollution are depleting oxygen from oceans: study

#61

Post by edoo »

mempko wrote: post #59
edoo wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are almost always wrong with science when it comes to policies that aren't backed by a falsifiable hypothesis. It turns out animal fats are the safest fats and vegetable oils are poison. It turns out you don't have to worry about eating cholesterol. The same for salt. The climate hoax is about to be called out for what it is due to the models exponentially diverging from reality. They claim the ozone hole is shr…

And yet, here we are, 30 years later, still increasing emissions, still using fossil fuels, still having a weak global coordination. How long do you expect this 'climate hoax plan' to take? Another 10 years? When will the 'globalists' finally take over with their climate hoax plan?

They already took over and are now trying to avoid a credibility crisis. We've been living the 1984 socialist dystopia for decades, but it is really starting to show lately.

Re: Climate change and nutrient pollution are depleting oxygen from oceans: study

#62

Post by jellicle »

topologistics wrote: post #46
endorphone wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Warmer waters hold less oxygen. This is fundamental, scientific fact.. The article specifically mentions the relatively small problem of run-off, and then the broader problem of, you know, entire oceans. A relatively constant, albeit still problematic, issue with runoff is pretty mild compared to the potentially for extremely wide-scale change from climate, hence the alarmism. To snidely quote from the beginning of y…

Is there any particular reason you are so snarky, rude, and dismissive? Is there any particular reason that people on Hacker News become so snarky, rude, and dismissive whenever the topic of climate change comes up? It's not even a conversation when people are just talking past each other.

Well, the root comment here is boldly assertive but completely wrong on the facts. What sort of reply should it receive?

Re: Climate change and nutrient pollution are depleting oxygen from oceans: study

#63

Post by User23 »

topologistics wrote: post #46
endorphone wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Warmer waters hold less oxygen. This is fundamental, scientific fact.. The article specifically mentions the relatively small problem of run-off, and then the broader problem of, you know, entire oceans. A relatively constant, albeit still problematic, issue with runoff is pretty mild compared to the potentially for extremely wide-scale change from climate, hence the alarmism. To snidely quote from the beginning of y…

Is there any particular reason you are so snarky, rude, and dismissive? Is there any particular reason that people on Hacker News become so snarky, rude, and dismissive whenever the topic of climate change comes up? It's not even a conversation when people are just talking past each other.

Yes, because it’s a political topic that's, pragmatically speaking, only science adjacent. To be clear I'm talking about discussions on the topic, not the merits of the work posted.

If I say “general relativity is likely wrong, but we should use the verifiable predictions it makes” no one will care. If I say “climate models are likely wrong, but we should use the verifiable predictions they make” the hackles will rise despite there being no known climate model with predictive power anywhere close to GR.

Obviously this makes the discussions far less rewarding to one’s intellectual curiosity. Like a fool I still check occasionally on the off chance that there is something interesting to be learned.

Re: Climate change and nutrient pollution are depleting oxygen from oceans: study

#64

Post by AlexandrB »

taxidump wrote: post #53
endorphone wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you read an article citing the conclusions of an international group with 15,000+ experts in their respective field, many member nations and their scientific establishment, etc, and you believe some random comment by some random guy on the internet adds "clarity", you need to really reconsider how you evaluate information. This is how we ended up in the situations of enormous ignorance in the climate change and im…

That "blowhard" has added more to this discussion than you have with this comment. Would you like to counter his position, or just call names?

He “added” a big pile of misinformation[1]. If I add three paragraphs of speculation about how deoxygenation is actually caused by vaccines am I also “adding to this discussion”?

[1] as documented by NeedBigTea: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21736510

Re: Climate change and nutrient pollution are depleting oxygen from oceans: study

#65

Post by jellicle »

krona wrote: post #55

If this were a simple result of rising ocean temperatures on a global scale, wouldn't we expect oxygen levels in the atmosphere to increase? That doesn't seem to be happening (quite the opposite.) So, where is the oxygen?

There isn't a lot of oxygen in water to start with, as solubility is low. If we somehow made the Earth's oceans completely oxygen-free, it wouldn't add noticeably to the amount of oxygen in the air.

Re: Climate change and nutrient pollution are depleting oxygen from oceans: study

#66

Post by simonsarris »

NeedMoreTea wrote: post #58
simonsarris wrote: post #8

Boy are characterizations like this getting tired. An actually accurate title would read something like: Farm and industry run-off in certain areas of the world is depleting oxygen in certain parts of the ocean. The vast majority of the issue isn't related to rising temps, it would still be there if there were no rising temps. It is the agricultural and industrial runoff in what I suspect are very, very specific part…

Page 109 is a summary specifically relating to estuaries and semi-enclosed seas. There are multiple other summaries relating to other ocean types preceding it. From the executive summary at the beginning: The loss of oxygen in the ocean can broadly be put down to two overlying causes – eutrophication as a result of nutrient run-off from land and deposition of nitrogen from the burning of fossil fuels, and the heating…

Yes! That's the problem! Read the BBC article again: Do they mention that the 700 ocean sites are specifically related to estuaries and semi-enclosed seas? They don't? Hm.

I'm responding to something presented in the BBC article, something they mention context-free, because they want to(?) imply that the problem is related to open ocean temp changes, when... it's not. It's a problem of eutrophication.

It's still a man-made problem, maybe its exacerbated by additional forces, but its dishonest to paint it as if warming has caused these 700 dead zones. Warming did not. Eutrophication did. Most people who read this:

> While nutrient run-off has been known for decades, researchers say that climate change is making the lack of oxygen worse.

> Around 700 ocean sites are now suffering from low oxygen, compared with 45 in the 1960s.

Will think that climate change caused the 700 ocean sites, up from 45, and not run-off. It's how they are couching it. It is bad and we should scrutinize that.

Re: Climate change and nutrient pollution are depleting oxygen from oceans: study

#67

Post by bayarrhea »

Phylter wrote: post #17
simonsarris wrote: post #8

Boy are characterizations like this getting tired. An actually accurate title would read something like: Farm and industry run-off in certain areas of the world is depleting oxygen in certain parts of the ocean. The vast majority of the issue isn't related to rising temps, it would still be there if there were no rising temps. It is the agricultural and industrial runoff in what I suspect are very, very specific part…

Honestly, sensational headlines like this are why so many people have a difficult time buying into climate change. If the media would present it as it actually is then I think more people would get on board.

No, it’s because those people have a deep mistrust of science and expertise, and using as much oil as possible is tied into some weird, macho, and at times oddly Christian identity, and suggesting that that’s harmful is threatening to them.

Re: Climate change and nutrient pollution are depleting oxygen from oceans: study

#68

Post by the_narrator »

Phylter wrote: post #17
simonsarris wrote: post #8

Boy are characterizations like this getting tired. An actually accurate title would read something like: Farm and industry run-off in certain areas of the world is depleting oxygen in certain parts of the ocean. The vast majority of the issue isn't related to rising temps, it would still be there if there were no rising temps. It is the agricultural and industrial runoff in what I suspect are very, very specific part…

Honestly, sensational headlines like this are why so many people have a difficult time buying into climate change. If the media would present it as it actually is then I think more people would get on board.

That is the problem. Without actual proof of something, sensational headlines are mandatory.

Re: Climate change and nutrient pollution are depleting oxygen from oceans: study

#69

Post by bayarrhea »

edoo wrote: post #35
endorphone wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Science isn't there to make you feel good, motiviated, etc. They're just pointing out what's happening to the best of their abilities to measure and analyze. Demanding a feel-good or less dire reporting on it isn't a solution.

They are almost always wrong with science when it comes to policies that aren't backed by a falsifiable hypothesis. It turns out animal fats are the safest fats and vegetable oils are poison. It turns out you don't have to worry about eating cholesterol. The same for salt. The climate hoax is about to be called out for what it is due to the models exponentially diverging from reality. They claim the ozone hole is shr…

Can you cite any of this?

Re: Climate change and nutrient pollution are depleting oxygen from oceans: study

#70

Post by bayarrhea »

edoo wrote: post #61
mempko wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet, here we are, 30 years later, still increasing emissions, still using fossil fuels, still having a weak global coordination. How long do you expect this 'climate hoax plan' to take? Another 10 years? When will the 'globalists' finally take over with their climate hoax plan?

They already took over and are now trying to avoid a credibility crisis. We've been living the 1984 socialist dystopia for decades, but it is really starting to show lately.

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