Dented Reality: Magic Leap Sees Slow Sales, Steep Losses • Hacker News Board

Re: Dented Reality: Magic Leap Sees Slow Sales, Steep Losses

#81

Post by dylan604 » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 9:40 PM UTC

LegitShady wrote: post #63

daenz wrote: post #12

The thing that got me about the Magic Leap is I couldn't find a reliable video of what it looked like through the lenses. Everything was clearly a CGI overlay or recreation. Reviewers claimed they were prohibited from showing video through the lenses.[0] I can understand not wanting their product misrepresented, but all the secrecy and censorship about it makes me believe it is bad, and I'm not going to spend money o…

I thought the same thing. Even with VR people held cameras up to the displays, or projected what they saw onto a monitor. With magic leap it was sooo secret. I assumed garbage. I'm still not sure what I would be supposed to do with them.

VR allowed the signal going to the headset to also be displayed onto a regular monitor since the signal was the full image. With AR, it's just overlaying something onto a lens you see through to be able to see the real world. That signal displayed onto a regular monitor would probably just show the object with a matte or essentially the object over a black background. Think of a transparent PNG but in motion. That's not very exciting.

Re: Dented Reality: Magic Leap Sees Slow Sales, Steep Losses

#82

Post by simias » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 9:43 PM UTC

daenz wrote: post #12

The thing that got me about the Magic Leap is I couldn't find a reliable video of what it looked like through the lenses. Everything was clearly a CGI overlay or recreation. Reviewers claimed they were prohibited from showing video through the lenses.[0] I can understand not wanting their product misrepresented, but all the secrecy and censorship about it makes me believe it is bad, and I'm not going to spend money o…

TFA says that they've shipped around 6000 units so far, how come nobody has made an independent video of the product yet? Surely some of these early adopters have a Youtube channel?

Re: Dented Reality: Magic Leap Sees Slow Sales, Steep Losses

#83

Post by jayd16 » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 9:44 PM UTC

pvarangot wrote: post #33

jayd16 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is way overblown. They have at least a Hololens equivalent, and if you value occlusion, they're ahead. And that's without Microsoft's reach. Equating them to vaporware isn't fair at all.

Have you used one?

Both.

Re: Dented Reality: Magic Leap Sees Slow Sales, Steep Losses

#84

Post by unlinked_dll » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 9:45 PM UTC

>He still personally signs off on new hires, who are told that it’s harder to get a job at Magic Leap than it is to be accepted into Harvard

I doubt that. South Florida isn't crawling with engineering talent, we all left. Having known, studied, and worked with several people who work(ed) there, I sincerely doubt they can claim to have such a deep bench of talent.

Re: Dented Reality: Magic Leap Sees Slow Sales, Steep Losses

#85

Post by filoleg » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 9:46 PM UTC

daeken wrote: post #3

I bought one second-hand a couple months ago. It's neat and all, but between the poor software and the severe extent to which it darkens the rest of the world, it's a pretty resounding 'meh'. I still have hopes for using it for productivity, but it honestly doesn't hold a candle to the original Hololens. (Can't speak to the Hololens 2 yet; going to get one in a little while though, hopefully!)

I haven't gotten a chance to try Magic Leap myself, but if you think that Magic Leap doesn't hold a candle to the original Hololens, then in it is dead in the water imo. I was somewhat annoyed with how small the field of view was on Hololens, and overall it was a pretty janky experience that I wouldn't recommend to anyone except those who just want to try the first "real" AR headset product out here and attempt writing code for it.

Hololens 2 is already publicly available, and I had a chance to play with it for a bit. All I am going to say is, if you thought the original Hololens was decent enough, you will be blown away by Hololens 2. It is leaps ahead of the first version, both in terms of the UX and the tech. Even everything auxiliary about it just feels "right", stuff like the flippable visor, easier head mount, etc. It is the kind of a device that I would legitimately consider using occasionally at home to read news and do other stuff while lazying around doing other things.

It isn't at the original iPhone levels of "whoa, we are entering a new era of how people use their personal computing devices" yet, but the overall experience is such a large step up from the original Hololens, it is clear as day to me that AR is quickly getting closer to the point where it will be dominating personal computing niche currently occupied by smartphones.

Re: Dented Reality: Magic Leap Sees Slow Sales, Steep Losses

#86

Post by Havoc » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 9:47 PM UTC

>He then told employees to “stay the course” and “protect the company” by keeping confidential information “under lock and key.”

Classic. Instruction to team to not leak info get leaked.

Re: Dented Reality: Magic Leap Sees Slow Sales, Steep Losses

#87

Post by jandrese » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 9:48 PM UTC

ogre_codes wrote: post #67

AR is a somewhat difficult sell, particularly with limited software available for it. Just imagine playing the interactive games they promoted in their demo videos, it would cost $10,000 in gear alone to get a 4 player game going. To me, AR sounds great when you are mobile and apps can supplement reality with useful information. Playing Minecraft or some kind of space invaders game in my kitchen isn't that much more…

AR for games is an even harder sell IMHO because it's very hard for the game developer to make use of your space in a compelling way since they have no idea what it might look like, at least for home use.

I could see it as a carnival or arcade attraction where the AR application is tightly coupled with the space it is in, but this is a niche application.

Re: Dented Reality: Magic Leap Sees Slow Sales, Steep Losses

#88

Post by AndrewKemendo » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 9:48 PM UTC

simias wrote: post #82

daenz wrote: post #12

The thing that got me about the Magic Leap is I couldn't find a reliable video of what it looked like through the lenses. Everything was clearly a CGI overlay or recreation. Reviewers claimed they were prohibited from showing video through the lenses.[0] I can understand not wanting their product misrepresented, but all the secrecy and censorship about it makes me believe it is bad, and I'm not going to spend money o…

TFA says that they've shipped around 6000 units so far, how come nobody has made an independent video of the product yet? Surely some of these early adopters have a Youtube channel?

There are plenty of independent videos available. Here's Tested's in-depth review from last year:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vrq2akzdFq8

Re: Dented Reality: Magic Leap Sees Slow Sales, Steep Losses

#89

Post by DonHopkins » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 9:48 PM UTC

dreamcompiler wrote: post #78

DonHopkins wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was some overlap, and both had lots of "Magic" hype, but there were some really great people working at General Magic, and not nearly as high a level of narcissistic bullshit and self aggrandization and utterly dishonest marketing as from Magic Leap. I mean, come on: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w8J5BWL8oJY

Completely agree. The GM people were competent without being arrogant. They failed only because cellular data networks were not good enough at the time.

Bill Atkinson is the humblest, sweetest, most astronomically talented guy -- practically the opposite of Rony Abovitz! I think they're on very different drugs.

The Psychedelic Inspiration For Hypercard, by Bill Atkinson, as told to Leo Laporte.

"In 1985 I swallowed a tiny fleck of gelatin containing a medium dose of LSD, and I spent most of the night sitting on a concrete park bench outside my home in Los Gatos, California." ...

https://www.mondo2000.com/2018/06/18/the-inspiration-for-hyp...

Full interview with lots more details about the development of HyperCard:

https://twit.tv/shows/triangulation/episodes/247?autostart=f...

Bill Atkinson's guest lecture in Brad Meyer's CMU 05-640 Interaction Techniques class, Spring 2019, Feb 4, 2019:

https://scs.hosted.panopto.com/Panopto/Pages/Viewer.aspx?id=...

Including polaroids of early Lisa development.

About PhotoCard:

http://www.billatkinson.com/aboutPhotoCard.html

PhotoCard by Bill Atkinson is a free app available from the iTunes App store, that allows you to create custom postcards using Bill's nature photos or your own personal photos, then send them by email or postal mail from your iPad, iPhone or iPod touch.

Bill Atkinson, Mac software legend and world renowned nature photographer, has created an innovative application that redefines how people create and send postcards.

With PhotoCard you can make dazzling, high resolution postcards on your iPad, iPhone or iPod touch, and send them on-the-spot, through email or the US Postal Service. The app is amazingly easy to use. To create a PhotoCard, select one of Bill's nature photos or one of your own personal photos. Then, flip the card over to type your message. For a fun touch, jazz up your PhotoCard with decorative stickers and stamps. If you're emailing your card, it can even include an audible greeting. When you've finished your creation, send it off to any email or postal address in the world!

Re: Dented Reality: Magic Leap Sees Slow Sales, Steep Losses

#90

Post by yalogin » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 9:49 PM UTC

Is anything else expected out of it? I mean, the way the company has rolled on, starting with a lot of in fighting, then releasing a bunch CGI videos about experience and never actually releasing any real use cases. They ended up launching the product without really showing anyone what the experience will be. People want to see what it is before spending an obscene amount on it. I fully expected it to fail.