A Week in the Life of a McDonald’s Cashier • Hacker News Board

Re: A Week in the Life of a McDonald’s Cashier

#551

Post by Baeocystin » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 7:40 AM UTC

bayarrhea wrote: post #545

Baeocystin wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I worked as a welder in a shipyard for a couple of years after the .com crash. No complaints, I actually enjoyed the work, but it was exhausting in a way that no office job can compare. The experience also makes me want to throttle folks who have never lifted anything heavier than a pen as I hear them whine about utter trivial things. I don't, because it is considered rude to throttle one's co-workers. The urge remai…

Can we stop acting like work is a competition? People with shittier jobs don’t have a monopoly on complaining. Otherwise, I could say “oh yeah? What about people who worked with asbestos and died? You think welding is hard? What about dying from lung cancer, HMMM?” Just because your work isn’t as grueling as someone else’s doesn’t mean you don’t get to be unhappy or dissatisfied with it.

That's not the point I'm after. I liked my welding job. A lot, actually. I never felt it was a 'shitty job'. But I also like not dying by industrial accident or poisoning my body with metal fume. And the stresses of a career in tech are much more tolerable when you have other work to compare it to.

Having a wider perspective leads to a greater appreciation for what one has, after all. And that is a good thing.

Re: A Week in the Life of a McDonald’s Cashier

#552

Post by lsiebert » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 7:43 AM UTC

Noumenon72 wrote: post #481

seem_2211 wrote: post #399

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems like the struggle for people in these jobs is mostly around the consistency in hours, and the miserly low pay. Both of which are deliberate choices by the firms that employ them. To some degree, serving the "customer" by cutting labour costs to the bare minimum (as a way to minimize the cost of everything), means we create an awful existence for the people who depend on these jobs for a living. The tyranny o…

I am with you on: * not having to cut labor to the minimum as a basic value * sooo many jobs would be unobjectionable at 8 hours per week. Almost any job. * professions should be designed to balance physical and mental labor, particularly to offer breaks from painful standing. I am not with you on: * Giving people 167% of the average hourly wage for an easy job like retail. As a society, we do not _want_ retail to be…

A poverty wage like the one company's pay many people keeps people trapped in jobs like cashier at mcdonalds.

When you are that poor, you need every hour of work you can get to make rent, buy food etc. You can't take time off to interview for a better job, or to study for a new career. You are stressed from a thousand extra decisions about money that the cushion of a little extra cash could save you. Also you are one emergency or injury or illness away from losing your apartment, or going hungry.

That's why advocates call for a living wage, a wage that people can make enough to live on. If they have the capability to do more, then that gives them a better chance to achieve it.

Though there will still need to be people working retail.

As for how fun it is to interact with people... that definitely depends on who you are and who you are interacting with. If you know someone working retail, ask them how it is.

Re: A Week in the Life of a McDonald’s Cashier

#553

Post by lsiebert » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 7:47 AM UTC

MuffinFlavored wrote: post #476

duxup wrote: post #112

I worked a pizza (among others) job through high school and college. I've been overworked at many professional technical jobs in different roles before. I'm paid a great deal more now, and yet I was never more tired or worn out or found it hard to study than when I worked the ovens at the pizza place. I often work with people who have never worked such jobs. They're upset that they're 'overworked' and spend their tim…

I think this is the biggest problem America has as a country now. People dying in the streets due to lack of healthcare/homelessness, and being stuck delivering pizza with no real routes to get out other than to “learn to code”...

Agreed. Plus so many opportunities for people bypass the working poor. Sure, a full time bootcamp might be tuition free or offer a scholarship, but it doesn't pay rent or buy food.

Re: A Week in the Life of a McDonald’s Cashier

#554

Post by lsiebert » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 7:51 AM UTC

lurquer wrote: post #164

thinkloop wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no bigger lie than hard work = prosperity. It is literally the exact opposite. Think of the hardest shittiest jobs and they are almost always the least paying. The richer you get the less hard work is, until you're able to reach the pinnacle of doing absolutely nothing but managing your money and taking advantage of discounted cap gains taxes. I grew up rich with every opportunity and never had one of these…

>There is no bigger lie than hard work = prosperity. It is literally the exact opposite. Hard work leads to prosperity. That's not the same as equating prosperity to hard work. Most prosperous people achieved prosperity due to earlier hard work and sacrifice of themselves (or their immediate ancestors.) Clearly, the 'value chain', as you put it, exists as evidenced by the numerous posts on this thread of describing t…

The best predictor of income, more then academic performance, more then having married parents or educated parents or going to pre school, is parental wealth.

And this is true whether your folks won the lottery or earned their money through hard work.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/05/29/study-to-succeed-in-america-...

Re: A Week in the Life of a McDonald’s Cashier

#555

Post by TeMPOraL » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 8:00 AM UTC

pm90 wrote: post #547

mrtksn wrote: post #544

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The same can be argued for anybody. For example, Engineers who don't start their own companies are at fault when the company they work for goes tits up and they are unemployed at an advanced age and unemployable because of their outdated skillset. The truth is, I think, nobody perfectly optimizes their prospects. People are people and people like to be in their social groups and compete in their social groups, which…

Not sure why you’re being downvoted as this is pretty accurate. American success has been predicated on the availability of these social goods which can change peoples lives.

Perhaps because of arguing that people choose this state. Some do, but many (most) are thrust into a particular direction.

Re: A Week in the Life of a McDonald’s Cashier

#556

Post by seem_2211 » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 8:01 AM UTC

lsiebert wrote: post #552

Noumenon72 wrote: post #481

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am with you on: * not having to cut labor to the minimum as a basic value * sooo many jobs would be unobjectionable at 8 hours per week. Almost any job. * professions should be designed to balance physical and mental labor, particularly to offer breaks from painful standing. I am not with you on: * Giving people 167% of the average hourly wage for an easy job like retail. As a society, we do not _want_ retail to be…

A poverty wage like the one company's pay many people keeps people trapped in jobs like cashier at mcdonalds. When you are that poor, you need every hour of work you can get to make rent, buy food etc. You can't take time off to interview for a better job, or to study for a new career. You are stressed from a thousand extra decisions about money that the cushion of a little extra cash could save you. Also you are one…

100%. One of the things you that happens when you have an emergency fund is that emergencies don't happen so often. This isn't the case when you're trying to get $3.50 to last till payday.

Re: A Week in the Life of a McDonald’s Cashier

#557

Post by abvdasker » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 8:08 AM UTC

soulofmischief wrote: post #508

I’ve worked in the fast food industry for 14 years—about half my life Can someone give me an anecdotal example of how this could come to be without some fault in Brown's decision-making process? For starters, I've always heard that commute time is inversely proportional to career mobility. I made it a rule not to work anywhere farther than half an hour away. And that is the absolute maximum which was necessary when I…

> I made it a rule not to work anywhere farther than half an hour away. And that is the absolute maximum which was necessary when I lived rural area.

To me it sounds like you're saying, "why doesn't she live closer to her workplace?" which carries with it a kind of subtext of blame. Reading the article a few possible explanations for her choice come to mind.

The author mentions she lives with her boyfriend's parents. Probably this is the cheapest possible living arrangement available to her. Living closer would probably require her to live independently, which tends to be more expensive. This may be compounded by more expensive rents closer to her place of work, which turns out to be a common problem for the working poor and an age-old cruelty of capitalism: Poor people have higher transportation costs -- both in terms of time and money -- because they can only afford to live far from urban centers where their jobs usually are. It's just one of the many ways the old saying "it's expensive to be poor" turns out to be objectively, measurably true.

It's also totally possible that none of the above applies and the author is not being smart with her money, or may have a drug habit, or may be "complacent". But we certainly shouldn't assume these things about her, because we just don't know her circumstances.

Apologies if this comes across as pedantic, but I think the mistake you may be making is projecting your narrow personal experience of your mother's problems onto a complete stranger, whose circumstances seem quite different than your mother's based on the article (the admittedly limited information we have about the author's situation).

It's heartening to see that you recognize your perspective may stem from your own problems with empathy. The author David Foster Wallace has written much (an understatement) about empathy and awareness, but probably the best short work of his about these subjects is this speech. I still find it to be a really good reminder of all kinds of things:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CrOL-ydFMI

Re: A Week in the Life of a McDonald’s Cashier

#558

Post by seem_2211 » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 8:08 AM UTC

vector_spaces wrote: post #543

soulofmischief wrote: post #508

I’ve worked in the fast food industry for 14 years—about half my life Can someone give me an anecdotal example of how this could come to be without some fault in Brown's decision-making process? For starters, I've always heard that commute time is inversely proportional to career mobility. I made it a rule not to work anywhere farther than half an hour away. And that is the absolute maximum which was necessary when I…

The dominating terms in the calculus of a person's economic circumstances aren't intelligence, will, or moral righteousness. If you don't start out with wealthy family or relatives to bail you out of emergencies, unexpected expenses of just a couple hundred dollars are devastating and can take months to recover from. Not to mention all the more subtle network driven benefits like getting your foot in the door somewhe…

> And it required me to effectively make the best possible decision at all times. One thing I find interesting about your question is the implication that fallibility in someone's decision making process means they deserve poverty, and all the horrible shit that comes with it (like housing and food insecurity, and even bring forced to contend with dangerous conditions during pregnancy).

> I am no less fallible in my judgement today than I was when I was broke, the difference is that today I can afford to make bigger mistakes.

Nail on the head. People with money make just as many (if not more) mistakes with their cash than people who are struggling on minimum wage. They just don't feel it the same. Most people posting on HN aren't going to struggle to pay their bills if they go for coffee today, or even everyday this month.

Re: A Week in the Life of a McDonald’s Cashier

#559

Post by seem_2211 » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 8:09 AM UTC

excalibur wrote: post #133

Everybody seems to be latching on to the McDonald's part of her story, the author included. But it's the hospital part I find mortifying. McDonald's is pinching pennies left and right, it's their key to success. The hospital is not. How much would you guess they're charging per day for the average patient to stay there? I bet it's enough money to cover full-time employment and benefits for their food service workers.

Wack that a hospital doesn't insure health insurance... bet it's a non profit at that.

Criminal.

Re: A Week in the Life of a McDonald’s Cashier

#560

Post by adjkant » Fri, Dec 06, 2019, 8:12 AM UTC

sterkekoffie wrote: post #211

larrywright wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There’s a compelling argument that unions, combined with the fight for $15 minimum wage, will do nothing but make the situation worse. Nobody is going to pay $20 for a burger and fries. McDonald’s would either have to go almost entirely automated or cease to exist as a company.

In 2017, McDonald's had 235,000 employees and paid its shareholders $7.7 billion. Compelling argument, all right.

Some math to really drill this home: that's 32K per employee. Literally a livable wage around 50% higher than the minimum they offer currently for someone working 40 hours year round, no vacation.