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How to play with people who are better than you

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Re: How to play with people who are better than you

#171

Post by Tarsul »

dllthomas wrote: post #136
bluedino wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are plenty of competitive weight lifting sports. CrossFit, Olympic lifting, powerlifting...

I would probably have fun shooting free throws with Steph Curry, even though I would be lucky to make as many as he missed. That's more like the weight lifting you're comparing it to - the competition involves artificially choosing the other person as a benchmark, and I can work against whatever internal benchmark I want. This is very different than a game of one-on-one, where it's his job to change how I interact wi…

" I would probably have fun shooting free throws with Steph Curry, even though I would be lucky to make as many as he missed." I think you're underselling yourself (or Steph) with it. He makes over 90% freethrows, which would mean - for the sake of your argument - that you'd be "lucky" to make more than 10% of your freethrows. I think you are better :) (sorry for this nitpick)

Re: How to play with people who are better than you

#172

Post by Tarsul »

logfromblammo wrote: post #130
SmellyGeekBoy wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not a Settler of Catan fan, then?

I'm not aware of any move that makes it impossible for any one player to win Settlers of Catan , while still extending the game to 2.5 hours. There are at least four basic strategies that work to win, and it's nearly impossible to block all of them to the other players while still pursuing one yourself. I have seen people win without ever building a third settlement.

i think the point of the parent is that the settlement phase at the start of the game can be pretty decisive. E.g. some people always choose crossroads with numbers that have low probably (like 11 or 3) or with only 2 aligned fields (instead of 3). Of course, you might still win the game but you're problaby too annoyed about your decisions in the first 5 minutes of the game than playing and having fun (and having a chance at winning). Especially in games where you collect ressources to gain victory points, making the wrong choices at the start can be very devastating (because of the runaway effect).

Re: How to play with people who are better than you

#173

Post by thiagomgd »

soperj wrote: post #139
tluyben2 wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And I don't find some games fun anymore if you or anyone around the table goes in for the kill; simple example that most people will know; monopoly. There are strategies to almost surely win but it makes the game boring and even annoying for everyone involved. So we usually added rules to prevent those strategies. If someone 'is better at that' it means he/she is a boring/non-fun player and no-one will play anymore a…

I find scrabble that way too. When people start blocking good letters just so that you don't use them, it starts to lose it's appeal.

This also happens with Ticket to Ride. But fortunately, most people I've played with, don't intentionally block routes they don't need at all

Re: How to play with people who are better than you

#174

Post by dllthomas »

Tarsul wrote: post #171
dllthomas wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would probably have fun shooting free throws with Steph Curry, even though I would be lucky to make as many as he missed. That's more like the weight lifting you're comparing it to - the competition involves artificially choosing the other person as a benchmark, and I can work against whatever internal benchmark I want. This is very different than a game of one-on-one, where it's his job to change how I interact wi…

" I would probably have fun shooting free throws with Steph Curry, even though I would be lucky to make as many as he missed." I think you're underselling yourself (or Steph) with it. He makes over 90% freethrows, which would mean - for the sake of your argument - that you'd be "lucky" to make more than 10% of your freethrows. I think you are better :) (sorry for this nitpick)

I welcome the nitpicking, but I stand by my statement :-p

Re: How to play with people who are better than you

#175

Post by blarg1 »

Ntrails wrote: post #98
6gvONxR4sf7o wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you want to get better, train up. This doesn't mesh with why lots of people play things. It's play. It might just be a nice way to pass the time. I would rather play basketball against someone my level than Steph Curry playing all out. I'm not playing to win or even to get better (getting better is fun, but isn't the point). I just want to have fun. For many kinds of play, if you have to train for it, you may as…

I used to play table tennis against my grandfather when I was in my mid teens (he was on the young side). At first, I needed a 15 point head start for it to be close (first to 21). After playing every day for a couple of months we started on equal terms and I only mostly lost. That was fun! I learned and improved but also every point I won was a victory. Had I played against a professional I'd probably never have won…

I use to play during lunch at college, but sometimes there were only asians to play against who hold the bat upside down and hit the ball so fast you could barely see it.

After a while I managed to return the ball back and forth a couple of times, maybe they were going easy on me tho :)

Re: How to play with people who are better than you

#176

Post by narag »

CogDisco wrote: post #58
narag wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A 600 ELO point difference in chess basically means you will never win, and it becomes futile, and crushing. But after losing a dozen times with that guy, you play against someone else and it's you that crush your opponent, so not so futile.

Assuming you can learn anything from the experience. What you might learn is weird idiosyncrasies and futile tactics playing from desperation. You might learn to not lose so quickly, but that's not the same as winning.

I don't keep playing lost games, I just resign. Maybe I should because I play mostly bullet, but as you say, you don't really learn anything interesting in those situations.

I do improve playing against better players than me. Like 200 or 300 this year. Maybe it's because I'm more focused when the opponent has a better rating.

Re: How to play with people who are better than you

#177

Post by brokenmachine »

saiya-jin wrote: post #56
earenndil wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least for me, part of the motivation with playing things is the idea that it is practice, and discipline, and improvement. Part of it is escapism, to be sure, but not all of it.

This is where each of us is unique mix - I couldn't care about improvement in things I do for fun. If it comes naturally, great, if it doesn't, same great. I know many people who aren't like that, especially competitive ones (which I consider a rather big disadvantage in life if one of your goals is to be a happy content person). The only reasons I do it - to have fun and relax - is already there, it doesn't get bett…

You can be competitive and still have fun.

In my sport, I train and enjoy competing as hard as I can.

I find the highs I enjoy from winning over a player who is a similar or higher skill level than me outweighs the disappointment of losing to someone I shouldn't. And it seems the better I get, the less often I seem to lose to people that I shouldn't. I enjoy seeing that progress and enjoy competing against better players.

I've lost close matches and still enjoyed every second too.

Re: How to play with people who are better than you

#178

Post by munmaek »

pkamb wrote: post #170
munmaek wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It really depends on how good the player is. I have played people in smash where the skill gap was so wide I could have just put my controller down and it wouldn't have made a difference. I literally lost a match in a tournament where I didn't, couldn't , touch the enemy once. I was probably the lowest seed in that tournament, he was the #1 seed, and was one of the top 5 players of the game. I normally like playing b…

Which version of Smash was that?

Super Smash Bros. Melee

Re: How to play with people who are better than you

#179

Post by brokenmachine »

tluyben2 wrote: post #63
mjfl wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're just playing to pass the time, why does it matter if you lose to Steph Curry or not?

If someone is off the scale better at something, playing becomes tedious and boring. That's not really fun to pass the time (or as a sport; when I go to kickboxing, I don't really expect the guy in our gym who won the EU championships a few times to KO me all day long like if he is competing to an equal). The reverse is true as well; unless teaching, why do they want to play with you. Boring for them too (unless they…

Steph Curry probably enjoys just being on a basketball court, even playing against people of much lower skill level. No reason he can't still work on perfecting his jumpshot for himself, even if it's only me guarding him. Lots of people practice shots by themselves.

I'm speculating here, but I think people who don't enjoy it on some level usually don't make it to that highest level in sport. Every top-level sportsman I can think of looks like they enjoy it.

Re: How to play with people who are better than you

#180

Post by brokenmachine »

tapland wrote: post #33
mjfl wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're just playing to pass the time, why does it matter if you lose to Steph Curry or not?

Because there is no excitement or any possibility of winning motivating you to even pretent do put effort in

Winning is not the only motivation though.

If I was playing against Steph Curry, I would try to come up with achievable goals, such as trying to defend well enough to force him to take a jumpshot instead of a layup, trying to make one of my own shots, trying to get him to fall for a pump-fake, trying to get a steal, trying not to fall over, etc.

Winning may not be, but there's always an achievable goal you can strive for.

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