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Aldous Huxley Foresaw America’s Pill-Popping Addiction

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Re: Aldous Huxley Foresaw America’s Pill-Popping Addiction

#171
post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno. I think it's whatever society will tolerate. It used to be pretty common in America to drink on the job. Plenty of folks worked/work and do cocaine. Heck, Freud was a huge cocaine addict, and he's still widely celebrated for his stim-induced work!

Yeah absolutely not. You can certainly drink and work, just as it's possible to drive drunk without killing someone. These isolated cases without incident don't really matter in the context of society-wide taboo, however. Coffee and cocaine are worlds apart. Most people don't have jobs that would work with a coke addiction. Freud was exceptional and I think he did most of his influential work not under the influence…

> Coffee and cocaine are worlds apart. Most people don't have jobs that would work with a coke addiction. Freud was exceptional and I think he did most of his influential work not under the influence anyway.

I have no caffeine tolerance as I rarely use it. Every time I have an espresso, the experience is practically identical to doing a bump of cocaine. The effects are so similar it's something I'll do when feeling nostalgic about past coke-filled city life years. I've been assuming others who enjoy an occasional espresso have similar memories being relived by the sudden stimulation it delivers.

Speaking of those coke-filled city life years, quite a few of my peers developed expensive coke habits and they were perfectly functional and many climbed their respective corporate ladders quite successfully while addicted to this substance.

The only thing separating cocaine and caffeine by a gap miles apart is cost and access.

If you can afford and access clean product, coke is a very productive and perfectly functional drug. I suspect most sociopathic high-level executives use it regularly, as it really amplifies that side of one's personality, which isn't necessarily undesirable for leadership roles at large organizations.

Don't forget cocaine once was in Coca-Cola. That wouldn't have occurred if it interfered with people's jobs.

Re: Aldous Huxley Foresaw America’s Pill-Popping Addiction

#172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Tolkien's Lord of the Rings...literary reactions to that time period It was also a response to WWI. Tolkein's childhood friends were killed and shattered by that war...and why? Because in 1831, Britain agreed to be a guarantor of Belgian neutrality. So when Gondor calls for aid... when Isildur calls the Men of the White Mountains to war... when Minas Tirith is besieged... what ought elves and men do but honour thei…

Tolkein apparently furiously denied allegory - although there are preexisting tropes that predate even his influence (decline of the mythic past Götterdämmerungn Atlantis) is hard to not see. Which I suppose probably owes itself both to decline of youthful myths like "parents and ancestors as infalliable" and the distant mutated memories of the Bronze Age collapse where the greatest empires indeed did fall from lofty…

He denied allegory with WW2 in the foreword to Lord of the Rings. It's nearly impossible that his own service in WW1 with its industrial warfare had no influence on his writing. Mordor bears a striking resemblance to the trench-infested battlefields of Europe.

Re: Aldous Huxley Foresaw America’s Pill-Popping Addiction

#173

I will probably go against the grain here but my inner tinfoil hat is telling me that the recent marijuana legalization is actually secretly run by the military industrial complex in order to silence dissent. Kind of the 'lithium in the water supply' thing.

> I will probably go against the grain here but my inner tinfoil hat is telling me that the recent marijuana legalization is actually secretly run by the military industrial complex in order to silence dissent. Kind of the 'lithium in the water supply' thing.

That's specious reasoning; consider that California had passed the compassion act in 1996, with the explicit intention of allowing this drug to be used for severe and chronic pain inlieu of harder narcotics (opioids). When the counties realized this was a cash cow, laws got relaxed and it was easier than ever to get high grade legally produced MJ, to the point where it was more accessible than alcohol or tobacco when I was growing up. The costs reflected that.

MJ legalization is and continues primarily be one of a money grab via taxes, in 2007 I went to CO on a school trip and I predicted that given the amount of illegal street deals MJ would have to be legalized at the recreational level, they were losing way too much tax revenue. In 2011 Amendment 64 was created, and in Nov of 2012 it was passed.

These trends and evidence is inline with basic projections of cause and effect from a local/state tax (or as its called in CO: revenue) matter and nothing less.

Japan did put lithium in their water in Aomori prefecture, and it had less than conclusive results on the general population to prevent suicide: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3863886/

Anecdote: Colorado has experienced a population boom since 2012, not a reduction in population, so I don't see the correlation.

Greta Thunberg and Extinction Rebellion were here earlier this year in Denver, eco-centric protests have and will continue to be a thing so no one is being docile, if anything most are appreciating how we must protect Nature and stop things like fracking now where prior to legalization it went on unfettered and was a significant Industry in the state. Now potable water for Ag and residential development use is scarce and fracking is partly to blame.

Anecdote 2: California still suffered raids from the DEA up until as late as 2012; I launched my startup in fintech to service the Industrial Hemp Industry in part because I was on campus during 'Operation Sudden Fall' in 2008. It was terrifying to see a University get occupied by the armed goons of the State.

Re: Aldous Huxley Foresaw America’s Pill-Popping Addiction

#174

I hate to be That Guy Who Argues With Everything, but I will. I'm a big fan of Huxley and Brave New World, but he wasn't particularly visionary with Soma. Drug use goes back as far as humankind does because people have been trying to cope with the stress of life since there have been people. If you're looking for a drug that helps with the anxieties of everyday life, alcohol would have my vote. It's been used for tho…

Yeah, Huxley was writing almost a century after the Opium Wars, which managed to reduce the greatest civilization on earth to a bunch of drug addicts within a few decades. Laudanum (10% tincture of opium) was extremely common within the late 19th and early 20th century Anglo-American world. The reason soma continues to resonate in literature is because it reflects fundamental truths of how the world works. Huxley did…

> reduce the greatest civilization on earth to a bunch of drug addicts within a few decades.

That's a tremendous exaggeration!

https://reason.com/2019/11/29/the-myth-of-the-opium-war/

Re: Aldous Huxley Foresaw America’s Pill-Popping Addiction

#175
post #17

I am a practicing anesthesiologist and I see every day what medications my patients take, because we review preoperatively their in home meds. And it's astonishing that a large chunk of population takes either psychiatric or psychoactive prescription meds plus cannabis, etc. I even have a joke that Americans voluntarily take meds that in Soviet Union were only given to the political prisoners.

This presents an interesting diversion: the phenomenon of anesthesiologists who are addicted to drugs. I worked with one who lost his position as chief because he was caught buying street drugs . . . on a city street. If people who are so well-educated about the effects of recreational drug use can still succumb to it, it's unreasonable to expect that the average person should be "smart enough" to be immune to the ri…

I have a couple comments.

First, most people are not at all "well-educated about the effects of recreational drug use", including medical professionals who are mostly only versed in the effects of legal drugs... Or are you referring to "legal" drugs here?

Second, there is a whole pharmacopeia of drugs that elicit a wide range of effects, and many of these drugs are not necessarily particularly "harmful" (e.g., the psychedelics). But really, moderation is the key ingredient in mitigating many of the compounding effects of repeated use (like physical dependency, which is a symptom only of certain classes of drugs).

Third, drugs are fun and people like to do them. Alcohol is a potentially debilitating, life-ruining drug, but we advertise it on the television. I would bet that most medical professionals consume alcohol.

Freedom is about assuming risk. Pretty soon we'll have no risk though, if the Plans continue as Planned.

Re: Aldous Huxley Foresaw America’s Pill-Popping Addiction

#176
post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno. I think it's whatever society will tolerate. It used to be pretty common in America to drink on the job. Plenty of folks worked/work and do cocaine. Heck, Freud was a huge cocaine addict, and he's still widely celebrated for his stim-induced work!

Yeah absolutely not. You can certainly drink and work, just as it's possible to drive drunk without killing someone. These isolated cases without incident don't really matter in the context of society-wide taboo, however. Coffee and cocaine are worlds apart. Most people don't have jobs that would work with a coke addiction. Freud was exceptional and I think he did most of his influential work not under the influence…

What about Stephen King? It seems he has mixed feelings about it today; regret, but he's also not sure he would have been so prolific without it.

I say all this as a person with zero cocaine experience, but lots and lots of caffeine experience. Stims don't make you better (usually worse, actually), but they do have a relationship to quantity of output.

Re: Aldous Huxley Foresaw America’s Pill-Popping Addiction

#177
post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah absolutely not. You can certainly drink and work, just as it's possible to drive drunk without killing someone. These isolated cases without incident don't really matter in the context of society-wide taboo, however. Coffee and cocaine are worlds apart. Most people don't have jobs that would work with a coke addiction. Freud was exceptional and I think he did most of his influential work not under the influence…

> Coffee and cocaine are worlds apart. Most people don't have jobs that would work with a coke addiction. Freud was exceptional and I think he did most of his influential work not under the influence anyway. I have no caffeine tolerance as I rarely use it. Every time I have an espresso, the experience is practically identical to doing a bump of cocaine. The effects are so similar it's something I'll do when feeling n…

> If you can afford and access clean product, coke is a very productive and perfectly functional drug. I suspect most sociopathic high-level executives use it regularly, as it really amplifies that side of one's personality, which isn't necessarily undesirable for leadership roles at large organizations.

I was agreeing with the sentiment of your post up until this point, I too cannot withstand caffeine, the most I'm willing to consime is found in most Kombucha and even then I try to break it into 3 servings now. I've worked in 2 Industries where Cocaine use is as common as coffee is in an normal office setting, its pretty alarming at times. The mood swings and emotional instability from constant use is something I don't think it lends itself to well-being, and 'productive' is a useless word in that context: if you close 5 deals and make the business a ton of money that day you're productive, but if you got there by raging, anting and throwing stuff at people who no longer want to give you leads or access to their sales pipeline what's the point?

Funny story, I was just re-watching Bourdain's podcast with Joe Rogan and they said that in England coffee shops were seen as dens of sedition and were being shut down, because prior to that mead was the drink of choice for the working class. Which lead to mass intoxication and made the effective rule of the Monarchs absolute; it was when they were 'sober' that it led to things like the Magnacarta was supposed to usher in (Workers Rights, Property Rights etc...)

Personally speaking my palate is too sensitive, which affects my current role as a chef, if I drink coffee (which smells and tastes like burned food) I cannot taste things correctly for hours. I will however de story cans of Thai Tea.

Re: Aldous Huxley Foresaw America’s Pill-Popping Addiction

#178
post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno. I think it's whatever society will tolerate. It used to be pretty common in America to drink on the job. Plenty of folks worked/work and do cocaine. Heck, Freud was a huge cocaine addict, and he's still widely celebrated for his stim-induced work!

Yeah absolutely not. You can certainly drink and work, just as it's possible to drive drunk without killing someone. These isolated cases without incident don't really matter in the context of society-wide taboo, however. Coffee and cocaine are worlds apart. Most people don't have jobs that would work with a coke addiction. Freud was exceptional and I think he did most of his influential work not under the influence…

Coffee and coaine are not actually worlds apart in terms of mechanism of action, they both act on the same brain pathway though coffee has a limited ability to activate this pathway in comparison to cocaine.

Re: Aldous Huxley Foresaw America’s Pill-Popping Addiction

#179
Did anyone see this part in the article:

Fentanyl wasn’t on offer, but agents kept following the digital trails that have made it easier for people like Muhammad and Yan to enter the global drug trade and for investigators to hunt them down. Because Yan used Gmail, operated by U.S.-based Google, Gibbons and his team could persuade a judge to let them monitor his communications in real time.

FAANG is an extension of the US' Law Enforcement and Intelligence Agencies, in case anyone had any doubts. This is why they get so much funding from both respectively, and why they can get away with such egregious infractions and unlawful behaviour.

Those of you dropping where you work should really have some reservations of what is taking place with your labour and in your name.

Re: Aldous Huxley Foresaw America’s Pill-Popping Addiction

#180
post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno. I think it's whatever society will tolerate. It used to be pretty common in America to drink on the job. Plenty of folks worked/work and do cocaine. Heck, Freud was a huge cocaine addict, and he's still widely celebrated for his stim-induced work!

I guess my opinion comes mostly from my own experience (friends/family on coke/meth have lead to problems in my life). I’d be glad (but surprised) if that was not most peoples experience

To be clear, I think alcohol, cocaine, and even caffeine do cause significant stressors on a life, to varying degrees and in different ways. They just aren't mutually exclusively with being highly productive in any given field.

Alcohol may be better aligned with physical labor, where there's some benefit from not noticing as much when you hurt + adrenaline spikes as it wears off. Cocaine probably aligns better with writing, when word vomit helps get something down that can later be edited. Neither has a particularly great track record with living a happy life.

Sometimes taboo makes it worse than it needs to be, though. An addiction, treated as a crime, leads to an even more desperate addict.

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