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Clear backpacks, monitored emails: U.S. students under constant surveillance

theguardian.com

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Re: Clear backpacks, monitored emails: U.S. students under constant surveillance

#301

Post by TeMPOraL »

ryanmercer wrote: post #157
krilly wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which bit of this are you upset with specifically? Monitoring internet access on school devices? That's been standard in every single school and workplace for decades. The clear backpacks are silly I'll admit, and also pointless. I agree that kids getting conditioned to be okay with surveillance is bad, but this is all coming from the private sector right now. In China, you now have to submit your face to be scanned…

>The clear backpacks are silly I'll admit, and also pointless. My fiance is a high school teacher, in the past two months they've had a student come to school with a handgun and be expelled and handed over to the police and another expelled for having legit dealer quantities (nearly a pound) of marijuana (packed and placed in mason jars in her backpack) in a state where it isn't legal at a state level. I can see why…

It's still crazy. It's not like opaque lunch boxes and paper bags are luxury items. Concealing a handgun or drugs isn't all that difficult.

Re: Clear backpacks, monitored emails: U.S. students under constant surveillance

#302

Post by CDSlice »

radmuzom wrote: post #286
philwelch wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Germany has barely made it to the 30 year mark of “not being a dictatorship” if you count the East. America has been one of the freest countries in the world for at least 150-some years.

Correct. So free that women got the right to vote in 1920s. African Americans in the 1960s.

Which other countries were much better? Obviously the fact that women and African Americans got the vote so late is not good, but America could still be one of the freest countries in the last 150 years if most everyone else was even worse.

Re: Clear backpacks, monitored emails: U.S. students under constant surveillance

#303

Post by jammygit »

detritus wrote: post #222
slowhand09 wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Funny this article coming from the Guardian which I believe is a British publication. And London being the only city in the top 10 for surveillance outside of China. https://www.comparitech.com/vpn-privacy/the-worlds-most-surv...

My local corner shop has about 16 CCTV cameras in it, covering as many angles in the shop as they can. This is common. Very common. I'm totally OK with that kind of apparently 'pervasive' CCTV coverage - we're not talking government-owned networked cameras linked up to face/gait/whatever recognition systems or deep cold storage banks, we're talking small store-owners keeping an eye on junkies and thieves. The oft-reg…

That sort of acceptance is why amazons ring is so dangerous: there are new business models around aggregating and automatically processing and mining that footage

Re: Clear backpacks, monitored emails: U.S. students under constant surveillance

#304

Post by lolc »

slothtrop wrote: post #129
lolc wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look up how many kids are killed by cars. Then go see how many are killed by guns outside school. Then check how many are killed by guns in school.

Far more school shooting deaths than any other developed country by my count. You're choosing to brush it off because it represents a small percentage of the population. That's a ridiculous position, you could hold the same if school shooting fatalities were in the 10,000s instead of 200s; too insignificant. The weight is in whether it's acceptable or it isn't, not how likely your kid is to get shot. It's been worse…

> You're choosing to brush it off because it represents a small percentage of the population.

That is what you concluded from what I am saying. Why did you conclude that?

> you could hold the same if school shooting fatalities were in the 10,000s instead of 200s; too insignificant

Oh but look at those magnitudes!

> You're either a) tacitly saying that the certainty of future school shootings is absolutely fine with you, or b) that it can't be helped, which isn't true. Pick one.

I did not intend to say either of those things. That's your interpretation. But again, why did you think that? My take: A good chunk of the population in the US is sold on alarmism and "something needs to be done".

> far stronger punishment for inebriated driving is due

Great. Another non-solution giving the appearance that something is being done.

Then when that doesn't work you cry for still more to be done. More punishment. More prying. It's a cycle I won't participate in. I'm disgusted by it!

Why aren't we discussing the resources these kids had, or didn't have, facing their adulthood? How come they decided the way to feel in control was shooting their peers? They're not the only ones! A lot of kids feel that. Few act it out. Thankfully. Why do they feel that? No matter, let's watch their backpacks for guns.

Re: Clear backpacks, monitored emails: U.S. students under constant surveillance

#305

Post by zepto »

nguoi wrote: post #220
tomatotomato37 wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someone looking to sneak a gun in would be hiding it in their pant's waistband or some other part of their clothes; inversely if they are looking to commit a public atrocity they'll skip the sneaking part altogether. Mandating clear backpacks is just as much security theater as is banning 4 oz liquid containers at the airport

I don't think that's a fair assertion. Even going in through the front doors with guns in their coats, the perpetrators of Columbine massacre used bags full of bombs. >if they are looking to commit a public atrocity they'll... Which gives everyone else a sooner notice to run away. This won't work for e.g. gang violence. >Mandating clear backpacks is just as much security theater as is banning 4 oz liquid containers a…

How were they stopped if bottles were allowed?

Re: Clear backpacks, monitored emails: U.S. students under constant surveillance

#306

Post by mamarjan »

ryanmercer wrote: post #195
lm28469 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Which bit of this are you upset with specifically? To me the upsetting part is that these kids must feel unsafe / monitored. Which is exactly what they shouldn't go through in school, it's far from a good start in life. But then again with all the school shootings I don't blame the security companies, it's a deep cultural/societal issue. It's similar to what happened in Europe in the last few years, now it's busine…

>To me the upsetting part is that these kids must feel unsafe / monitored. Many larger schools have their own police officers, because they have to. My fiance is a high school teacher and just out of her classes in the past 2 months she's had one student arrested and expelled for bringing a firearm to school and another for bringing nearly a pound of marijuana (in a state where it is illegal at the state level) to sc…

Kids do stupid things. But the "solution" presented, in form of increasing security measures, does not sound like a solution to me.

Maybe the schools need to change, and kids need to be integrated into the real world, instead of being retained in relatively pretty prisons with bad food until they're adults.

Re: Clear backpacks, monitored emails: U.S. students under constant surveillance

#307

Post by raincom »

chrisseaton wrote: post #180
markus92 wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's still blocking, not actively monitoring. Probably because it runs all network traffic through their VPN.

How do you block specific websites without monitoring which website is being visited? That doesn’t make any sense.

Banks are strict on their work laptops. - Everything is tunneled through VPN

- 2 FA

- geofencing at VPN level (you can't take work laptop to Russia, India, China, etc)

- everything is whitelisted. Some employees can only access x.theirBank.com, everything is else blocked. This is the case with tellers, folks in the retail banking

- even for IT/dev, one should get explicit permission to get access to youtube, github

- every work laptop comes with an agent like ZScalar, which enforces these policies by coordinating with a central server.

Re: Clear backpacks, monitored emails: U.S. students under constant surveillance

#308

Post by pnako »

philwelch wrote: post #179
foldr wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You could probably kill more people with knives So why are you worried about gun bans? You can just use a knife instead. I think you must know, really, that guns are more dangerous and effective than knives. That's why you want the right to own one. It's also why the US has frequent mass shootings in schools, whereas there are no instances of mass stabbings in UK schools. Just look at the recent terrorist incident…

> Just look at the recent terrorist incident in London. The guy killed two people with a knife before being restrained by unarmed members of the public. The people restraining him were armed with a fire extinguisher and a narwhal tusk, and he was ultimately subdued by the police shooting him with guns. Also, since banning guns didn’t actually seem to fix anything, they’re now working on banning knives. So you can’t j…

... that is, until they ban narwhal tusks too!

Re: Clear backpacks, monitored emails: U.S. students under constant surveillance

#309

Post by zepto »

nguoi wrote: post #252
noonespecial wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are an unlimited number of things that risk dead children. Chewing gum, shoelaces, bicycles, model rocketry, shop class, video game marathons, crosswalks... How sure do we have to be to ban them all? There is in my opinion a very clear danger associated with setting up draconian surveillance states borne out by history. How sure do we have to be before we ban those?

We do ban lots of things. They're children. >There is in my opinion a very clear danger associated with setting up draconian surveillance states borne out by history. In my experience, if everything that was compared to 1984 was actually like 1984, we'd be at war with Eastasia.

We don’t ban everything that carries as little risk as a backpack.

Re: Clear backpacks, monitored emails: U.S. students under constant surveillance

#310

Post by faissaloo »

rahuldottech wrote: post #20

THIS IS NOT OKAY. We can't have children being used to constant surveillance and accepting this as a part of life. It sets them up for so many problems in the future, where they won't understand the serious implications of constant tracking and surveillance. And sure, nothing too bad comes out of this stuff right now in most of the world, but have you seen China? The minute a government decides to do so, all that dat…

This among the many reasons I don't want my children in the education system.
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