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I'm not burned out, I'm pissed off

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Re: I'm not burned out, I'm pissed off

#121

Post by 2rsf »

zer00eyz wrote: post #53

"A new car built by my company leaves somewhere traveling at 60 mph. The rear differential locks up. The car crashes and burns with everyone trapped inside. Now, should we initiate a recall? Take the number of vehicles in the field, A, multiply by the probable rate of failure, B, multiply by the average out-of-court settlement, C. A times B times C equals X. If X is less than the cost of a recall, we don't do one." N…

> If X is less than the cost of a recall, we don't do one.

We didn't take into account loss of sales and reputation, the equation is not (should not) be that simple

Re: I'm not burned out, I'm pissed off

#122

Post by meloentje »

davidgl wrote: post #61
Aeolun wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Conversely, in a lot of industries the security department is only there to prevent you from doing everything you need to do, even if the threat and attack surface are both minimal.

Agreed, too often security people are incentivised to make a massive fuss over tiny issues, and then often don't seem to understand that security is just one of many requirements needing to balanced

So much this. In addition, these tiny issues are often purely technical in nature. I still have to meet the first security engineer who is able to identify informations security risks at the business level and view vulnerabilities in their proper context.

Re: I'm not burned out, I'm pissed off

#123

Post by TeMPOraL »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #106
_8j50 wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bro (or Sis? :) )! They're not supposed to care about security, you are! Our job in infosec is to show others how insecurity affects what they care about so in order reduce,transfer or eliminate risk to what they care about they allow us to implement good security. The failure is on the infosec side of the equation. It confounds and mildly pisses me off when people get pissed and get burned out over suits not caring…

This is what happens when companies don't understand security. https://www.csoonline.com/article/3410278/the-biggest-data-b... You think a million a year is expensive? It's not - not if it's saving you a $200m fine, and possible class action damages.

The trick is, how do you estimate risk of such problems in a particular company, in order to provide the suits with an expected dollar figure?

Re: I'm not burned out, I'm pissed off

#124

Post by jstewartmobile »

chahex wrote: post #42

You are not pissed off of your work. You are pissed off of yourself. You are not complaining because the work is wrong, you are complaining because you are angry within, and you believe it is not your fault. You are not taking responsibility of your emotions as you are supposed to and as taught by all the masters of wisdoms. Go back home and rethink who you are. The world is not changing for you unless you change you…

100% correct

Re: I'm not burned out, I'm pissed off

#125

Post by marcus_holmes »

formercoder wrote: post #77
shifto wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As well as cutting 98% of your workforce as no office employee knows how to work on anything different.

And of your productivity for those tied to excel, word, and powerpoint

this. I think most office workers couldn't care less if they run Windows. But they know those Excel hotkeys as well as any Vim hacker knows the escape key.

Re: I'm not burned out, I'm pissed off

#126

Post by czechdeveloper »

WJW wrote: post #115
czechdeveloper wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This I don't understand. You are interested in economy and politics, yet you don't know how to file taxes. Is that not connected? If you understand mechanics, yet can't do maintenance on your car, not even talking about fixing anything. This level of theoretical knowledge that can't overreach to reality to do basic tasks seems just irrelevant to me. What is it good for apart of talking about it?

There is joy to be had in just learning something. For some people, the knowledge is its own reward. Other people see knowledge only as a tool to achieve things they want. Based on your respective comments, I'd expect that the writer of the grandparent comment is the former type, while you are more the second type. Both are fine.

There is nothing wrong with doing stuff just for fun.

There is nothing wrong with being focused on just few issues.

But I have doubts when you claim some knowledge without being able to use it practically, which is what I see here.

If I'd say I'm jack of all trades, as I'm interrsted in software - but i hire a guy to make all the code for me because I don't know how - and that I'm very interested in knives - but my wife sharpens our knives as I don't know how - I have doubts about your actual knowledge if those fields.

Re: I'm not burned out, I'm pissed off

#127

Post by marcus_holmes »

badpun wrote: post #111
saiya-jin wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

General curiosity in some topic? I can talk quite a bit about firearms, ammunition etc. yet I never owned a gun, shot altogether maybe 5-8 rounds in my whole life (apart from BB gun). I like watching youtube channels like Demolition ranch or Iraqveteran8888 for their technical expertise, viewpoints and just fun. Without any real expectation to ever own a gun to expand on this knowledge. Maybe some nice bow one day (w…

Is somebody who watches people draw in their youtube channels interested in drawing, or in watching people draw? I'd say it's the latter.

Are the billions of people who watch sportsball even capable of playing whatever variety of sportsball?

Re: I'm not burned out, I'm pissed off

#128

Post by TeMPOraL »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #108
NeedMoreTea wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your mom and dad, or grandparents probably didn't need to know, even though they know how. Most of their interactions were with local businesses, with people who, like themselves, were part of the local community. The unofficial grapevine worked pretty well for rooting out the good and bad mechanics, lawyers and florists. Your dad could change the oil, but almost certainly knew which mechanics could be trusted to hav…

That's really the point of success in business - it gives you the ultimate privilege of hugely decreasing the odds that you'll be held responsible for damage you cause to others. Occasionally the wheels come off (maybe literally) and someone with significant power ends up in jail. But realistically - how often? Which is why software security and quality aren't a thing. There's no pressure to do the job properly and p…

> There's no pressure to do the job properly and plenty of incentive not to.

I won't name names, but doing some work for some company in IT security space once, I learned that one of the issue they faced in sales is that the product cannot be too good - because if it points out to a possible vulnerability and then that vulnerability gets exploited, the customer may be on the hook financially and legally, as the software could prove they knew about the problem and didn't address it.

Re: I'm not burned out, I'm pissed off

#129

Post by TheRealDunkirk »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #106
_8j50 wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bro (or Sis? :) )! They're not supposed to care about security, you are! Our job in infosec is to show others how insecurity affects what they care about so in order reduce,transfer or eliminate risk to what they care about they allow us to implement good security. The failure is on the infosec side of the equation. It confounds and mildly pisses me off when people get pissed and get burned out over suits not caring…

This is what happens when companies don't understand security. https://www.csoonline.com/article/3410278/the-biggest-data-b... You think a million a year is expensive? It's not - not if it's saving you a $200m fine, and possible class action damages.

It's tough for me to think that Yahoo! didn't "understand security," and yet, their entire user database was ganked. I have to assume that they were doing everything they could to implement all of the white paper suggestions and consulting recommendations they could get their hands on. I also presume they were running the largest, most-expensive "security" products that they could buy. The depressing thought that struck me at the time was: if one of the biggest web properties to ever exist couldn't figure out how to secure their database, what hope do the rest of us have? (Maybe I'm being naive; I've never seen a disclosure on the nature of the intrusion.)

All of this sort of thing leads me to think that there is currently a huge mismatch between the security products industry, and how companies implement all the conflicting white paper snake oil, and what the ACTUAL vulnerabilities are. And I know how stupid this mismatch winds up making the average Fortune 500 worker bee's daily life. But that's a topic for another post.

Re: I'm not burned out, I'm pissed off

#130

Post by tonyedgecombe »

roenxi wrote: post #40
javajosh wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Software costs ~0 to copy and distribute absolutely perfect copies, world-wide. To drive the price up you create artificial scarcity, mostly rooted in IP law. Important note for HN readers: 'driving the price up' is a net benefit for programmers. Artificial scarcity is why you get paid big bucks. Interestingly, data is legitimately scarce. But that's a discussion for another time...

> Important note for HN readers: 'driving the price up' is a net benefit for programmers. Well no, if it is hard to get software written people just won't bother. Most programmers will benefit from a commoditise-the-complement strategy where everyone is using software and need to hire programmers to tweak it to their exact needs. The money is in support & hardware. Trying to primarily compete on software price is pre…

I think there is some economic theory that states the price of products will tend towards the marginal cost over time. I haven't seen anything that makes me think software is any different.

I don't think there is much profit in hardware, most companies seem to work on razor thin margins.

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