Im a bit confused, at the point the police attached the unmarked tracking device on the suspects vehicle, did the suspect not obtain possession rights to the tracker? If not can the police just attach a device to you vehicle then charge you with theft immediately? How did the removal and subsequent storage result in theft if the device was already in the suspects possession?
Indiana man charged with theft for removing police tracking device from car
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Re: Indiana man charged with theft for removing police tracking device from car
#32Legally, what is happening when the police put a tracker on a car? It isn't a gift, or a transfer of ownership - otherwise the police retieving it would be theft. On the other hand, the vehicle owner should not be held responsible for damage to a device they don't know about. Does it become lost property?
If the disappearance of public property attached to a vehicle can be used to justify a search warrant, this seems like it would be ripe for abuse. The police could apply for a tracking warrant, wait a week, claim their tracker was lost, and then perform whatever searches they want on the private property.
Re: Indiana man charged with theft for removing police tracking device from car
#33Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'd like to hear more about this if you don't mind expounding on it some. I realize that in a certain light that's how it looks (I'm no stranger to a lot of what used to be called conspiracy theories, including the long history of illegal surveillance) but honestly it's always looked to me like the powers that be, in America, genuinely try to operate in a benign fashion. I realize that's not the same as operating in…
While there is no catching a criminal in this situation. Asset forfeiture is abused. This is where police take items, usually cash, and keep it. There is no trial, just a seizure of property. https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/12/1/16686014/p... It's a good example of what I mean. There are others, I'm just not going to post them all. The police seem to optimize for stats and profit. And the cities/counties…
The new doctrine is escalation of force to compliance. I have that info from public court, on the record.
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21603136
Protect and serve died decades ago.
Today, people literally die at the hands of police for errors, questions, mistakes, and failure to demonstrate blind compliance. <---that is no joke.
Re: Indiana man charged with theft for removing police tracking device from car
#34If you find something like that, you put it in a box and mail it back to the police.
Be sure to include an invoice with a hefty charge for shipping and handling.
Re: Indiana man charged with theft for removing police tracking device from car
#35Earlier quoted context omitted.
While there is no catching a criminal in this situation. Asset forfeiture is abused. This is where police take items, usually cash, and keep it. There is no trial, just a seizure of property. https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/12/1/16686014/p... It's a good example of what I mean. There are others, I'm just not going to post them all. The police seem to optimize for stats and profit. And the cities/counties…
The new doctrine is escalation of force to compliance. I have that info from public court, on the record. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21603136 Protect and serve died decades ago. Today, people literally die at the hands of police for errors, questions, mistakes, and failure to demonstrate blind compliance. <---that is no joke.
I just recently saw the video of the guy picking up trash with a claw/grabber and being told to drop his 'weapon'. Several police showed up to stop this threat from cleaning his property. Luckily though, no one was shot, and the officer that started it all resigned.
Re: Indiana man charged with theft for removing police tracking device from car
#36"Deputy Attorney General Jesse Drum argued that the deputies had not acted in bad faith" Is it typical for DAs to have lacking judgement? I know we hear about the bad ones but whenever any kind of insane police stunt appears in the media the DA is always on the police's side. I thought the judicial branch was supposed to be separate and neutral from the executive branch.
The DA is in the judicial branch?
> In most U.S. state and local jurisdictions, prosecutors are elected to office. On the federal level, district attorneys are, in effect, members of the executive branch of the government; they are usually replaced when a new administration comes into office.
Re: Indiana man charged with theft for removing police tracking device from car
#37Legally, what is happening when the police put a tracker on a car? It isn't a gift, or a transfer of ownership - otherwise the police retieving it would be theft. On the other hand, the vehicle owner should not be held responsible for damage to a device they don't know about. Does it become lost property? If the disappearance of public property attached to a vehicle can be used to justify a search warrant, this seems…
IANAL
My understanding is that it's the Police's property. If you find it, you can probably legally remove it from the car, but you can't keep it or prevent the Police from recovering it.
This might be interesting to you:
Re: Indiana man charged with theft for removing police tracking device from car
#38"They sought warrants to search Heuring’s home and the barn, alleging that there was probable cause that a crime had been committed — that Heuring had committed theft by taking off the GPS tracker. While searching the barn, they found the tracker in a bathroom locker. They also found evidence of drug use: a glass pipe. A subsequent search, granted by a judge based on the paraphernalia, uncovered bags of methamphetami…
They'd key onto that eventually (probably pretty quickly when it never returns to his house for a few days) and just recover and place another.
Re: Indiana man charged with theft for removing police tracking device from car
#39By this logic, with a simple warrant, the police could place a big, obvious microphone in the middle of your living room, label it "Police surveillance mic", and you would be forbidden from removing it. I find that much more troubling than any technicalities around 'did he know it belonged to the cops'. Just how much obedience can a simple warrant coerce out of supposedly free citizens?
Just stick an Amazon or Google logo on it and people will buy it and place it themselves..
Ha! Bravo
Re: Indiana man charged with theft for removing police tracking device from car
#40If you find something like that, you put it in a box and mail it back to the police. Be sure to include an invoice with a hefty charge for shipping and handling.
>Besides, Keating said, there was no indication that it belonged to law enforcement.
How do you know where to mail it?