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Allbirds CEO on Amazon's copycat strategy

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Re: Allbirds CEO on Amazon's copycat strategy

#81

Post by readams »

barbecue_sauce wrote: post #73
readams wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think most people don't know that shelf space is actively sold by the stores. They imagine the stores go out and find the best products to display. That's not what happens.

This really depends on the retail methodology of a company. Space allocation in a category planogram (layout) is often ultimately decided by the category manager (corporate person who is responsible for P/L of that category), but can be affected by the heavy hitters in that category using their internal "retail services" department to help said category manager formulate their planograms. This usually results in some…

The retailer is looking to maximize its own profit. It's not going to put a totally DOA product on the shelves, but they do charge slotting fees to allocate shelf space for products. There's always a large set of products they could put there, so those slotting fees end up being a major source of margin for the stores.

https://www.vox.com/2016/11/22/13707022/grocery-store-slotti...

Re: Allbirds CEO on Amazon's copycat strategy

#82

Post by kadoban »

hbosch wrote: post #65
kadoban wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just because it's common doesn't mean it's not also dodgy.

If you go to a grocery store, you'll find many versions of cheddar cheese specifically. Some of it is blocked, some slices, some shredded. You'll also find that in at least one of these forms, the store has it's own brand – called a "private label" – of cheddar cheese, probably shredded. Because Kroger, or Wal Mart, or Whole Foods has said "hey, selling cheddar cheese is a good idea and we can compete in our own stor…

There isn't a design there that's being copied or a brand being appropriated. I mean however many centuries back someone figured out cheddar cheese, but nobody alive has a proprietary claim to it.

Re: Allbirds CEO on Amazon's copycat strategy

#83

Post by cortesoft »

awshepard wrote: post #33
cortesoft wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, the law itself doesn't say only Coca-Cola can use the coca leaves.... they just have an exclusive deal with the only company that is licensed to import it.

Does that sort of regulatory capture accomplish the same effect though? If you're a competitor in the space, you'd either a) not have any access to an ingredient you want, or b) would have to go through the trouble of finding a new company to import it AND get them licensed (which I assume is likely a difficult thing to do). To an extent, the barrier to entry could end up so high that it's effectively _as if _ Coca-C…

Yes, it does. Just pointing out that Coca Cola isn't named in the law.

Re: Allbirds CEO on Amazon's copycat strategy

#84

Post by toasterlovin »

gist wrote: post #66
toasterlovin wrote: post #2

If you can't succeed because somebody made a low effort, low quality copy of your product, then you don't deserve to make money. Especially in light of the fact that Coke has been around for 150 years and is essentially just sugar water.

> Coke has been around for 150 years and is essentially just sugar water. Coke is still around (primarily) because of tremendous money spent on marketing and tremendous money spent on owning the channel of distribution of their products (where 'own' means defacto by how they operate).

Exactly my point. Figure out how to build a business that can withstand having its products copied.

Re: Allbirds CEO on Amazon's copycat strategy

#85

Post by toasterlovin »

benologist wrote: post #10
toasterlovin wrote: post #2

If you can't succeed because somebody made a low effort, low quality copy of your product, then you don't deserve to make money. Especially in light of the fact that Coke has been around for 150 years and is essentially just sugar water.

Amazon has copied 50,000+ items, some open source, some proprietary SaaS, they surely weren't all garbage undeserving of success. Predatory platforms might be the actual problem.

FWIW, it seems like you're referring to software. I'm commenting solely on their retail business (and that's what the linked article is about).

Re: Allbirds CEO on Amazon's copycat strategy

#86

Post by opencl »

CamelCaseName wrote: post #19
likpok wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The specific flavor/process of coke is protected, but you can get pretty close outside of that. Their other products are often indistinguishable (e.g. sprite/sierra mist). The value there is the brand, not the specific flavor. The special dispensation for Coke works on a branding level: "we have a special process dating back to 1890".

I'm not sure if this is how you're defining brand, but the real value is in their exclusivity agreements with restaurants and (some) grocers. This is the reason any restaurant that doesn't just resell soft drinks they bought at the grocery store only sells either Pepsi / Coca-Cola. It would be really interesting to see what kind of rates major chains/conglomerates (E.g. McDonalds, Subway, 3G, Recipe Unlimited, etc.)…

Wendy's does have their own "Dave's Sodas" brand.

Re: Allbirds CEO on Amazon's copycat strategy

#88

Post by _iyig »

toasterlovin wrote: post #2

If you can't succeed because somebody made a low effort, low quality copy of your product, then you don't deserve to make money. Especially in light of the fact that Coke has been around for 150 years and is essentially just sugar water.

What if the person who copies you also controls the marketplace, and prioritizes their copy above your original? That seems much closer to what Amazon is doing.

Re: Allbirds CEO on Amazon's copycat strategy

#89

Post by mipmap04 »

kadoban wrote: post #82
hbosch wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you go to a grocery store, you'll find many versions of cheddar cheese specifically. Some of it is blocked, some slices, some shredded. You'll also find that in at least one of these forms, the store has it's own brand – called a "private label" – of cheddar cheese, probably shredded. Because Kroger, or Wal Mart, or Whole Foods has said "hey, selling cheddar cheese is a good idea and we can compete in our own stor…

There isn't a design there that's being copied or a brand being appropriated. I mean however many centuries back someone figured out cheddar cheese, but nobody alive has a proprietary claim to it.

What about sodas like Dr. Pepper vs. Dr. Thunder? Do you think producing Dr. Thunder is ethically questionable from a business standpoint?

Re: Allbirds CEO on Amazon's copycat strategy

#90

Post by blotter_paper »

dkarl wrote: post #80
ghaff wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Serious question. Why is it dodgy?

It's dodgy for the same reason it's dodgy to print and sell a new novel without paying the author, for the same reason it's dodgy to clone a successful app and sell it without any attempt to improve on it. On one hand you have a system where companies support the creation of new designs so that they can profit from the reproduction of them, and on the other you have companies operating parasitically so they can get a…

I would be interested in seeing the results of an HN poll: "Do you agree with the existence of intellectual property laws?" It seems like a divisive topic here, and I suspect this is where the disagreement on dodginess comes from.
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