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The 40% Keyboard

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Re: The 40% Keyboard

#221

Post by folkrav »

roel_v wrote: post #144
kranner wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could just buy new keycaps and switch them on your current keyboard.

Only if you can find them with the labeling like you have your keyboard set up. It's the reason I switched away from Ergodox. If only someone would offer high quality custom keycaps, with double or triple labeling, using actual double shot injection moulding - which of course is pretty much impossible... But I'd pay $200 for a high quality key cap set that I can customize, so that I could have a printed Ergodox keyca…

Considering double-shot requires molds for every key, that would mean pretty much having a mold for every single key on every single profile. Perfectly possible, but that set would very likely cost more than the $200 you're saying you'd pay for it.

Re: The 40% Keyboard

#222

Post by ssully »

dsego wrote: post #173
me_me_me wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

God damn you cheating lefties! You cant have cake and eat it too! I really wish for keyboard options with numpad on the left. I am using numpad rarely but its handy to have when in need.

Not hard to learn to use the mouse with your non-dominant hand. It's just a couple of days of practice. And then switch between your left and you right every other day. Don't even have to flip the buttons, just learn to use the index for secondary and middle for primary clicks.

I am right handed but use my mouse left handed because growing up my Dad always had the mouse on the left side of the keyboard (because he is lefty). I used to move it to the right side, but gave up because the way our desk was basically required you to rerun the cable.

Re: The 40% Keyboard

#223

Post by the_gipsy »

Yizahi wrote: post #98

People like to talk a lot about KB ergonomics, reducing carpal syndrome and there is a reason for it, but I don't understand why almost nobody does the one thing that contributes the most for improvement - inverted KB stand. This thing on the bottom - https://imgur.com/a/yne4lPR . People fiddle with layouts, key travel, key shape, switches etc. but that doesn't really matter if your wrists are crooked. If your wrists…

Anything to back up these "facts"? There are many, many activities that require your wrist to be not straight. Playing musical instruments, sports...

Re: The 40% Keyboard

#224

Post by PeterisP »

Bayart wrote: post #87
dangus wrote: post #7

Call me cynical, but I think a lot of the small style keyboards I see around the office are more of a fashion trend than anything. I remember when the insistence was on number pads, and how dare they be removed from our laptops and desktop keyboards. Fast forward a few years and I was made fun of at a programming job for preferring a full keyboard with a number pads. I guess programmers are too cool to enter in dolla…

The lack of a numpad makes the main keyboard's part centered relative to the display, which is of tremendous importance as far as OCD is concerned.

It's not really about OCD but about physical strain. I like desktop keyboards with numpads, but for a few months I had to use a laptop with a numpad.... and it's horrible from ergonomics viewpoint, as either I'm sitting to the side of my screen leaning asymmetrically to the right or I have the screen in the proper position for my neck but my hands are curled in an inappropriate position towards the left.

It's not a big thing, but doing so for (say) 10 hours every day adds up and screws up my back. If a keyboard has a numpad, then it must be "movable" separately from the screen.

Re: The 40% Keyboard

#225

Post by devit »

Physically removing the number pad and the arrow keys can be useful because it allows the mouse to be placed closer to the center, but removing the number row and function keys doesn't seem to provide any significant benefit for desktop usage.

Re: The 40% Keyboard

#226

Post by PeterisP »

aeyes wrote: post #185
dsego wrote: post #176

Not sold on the RSI benefits. See, I bought a Planck, thinking that the ortholinear layout would make sense. But it didn't work really. Maybe I'm just accustomed to the staggered layout, but it just felt too cramped. Besides, I don't think that less movement automatically leads to less strain. In fact it felt like my fingers didn't get to stretch enough, and my wrists were too close for comfort. All in all, the mouse…

Your observation of micro movements of the mouse causing issues is hitting the nail on the head. This movement comes from the wrist and should be avoided. All pro gamers use a somewhat low sensitivity which forces the movement to come from the forearm instead of the wrist. Higher accuracy isn't the only reason, you'll get chronic wrist pain within a couple of months if the mouse movement comes from your wrist. I'd re…

IDK, I have my mouse set up so that the full movement range is something like an inch or less; wrist is stationary on table, palm is stationary and doesn't touch mouse, and all movement is done with fingers only. It's kind of the same as working on a touchpad, where also wrist is stationary and everything is done with fingers.

Re: The 40% Keyboard

#227

Post by aidenn0 »

me_me_me wrote: post #118
binarycrusader wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your mouse is closer so you don't have to move your hand as far. Not if you use a mouse left-handed ;) But more seriously, I grew up being trained to touch type in the classical way complete with ten-key exercises. I strongly prefer having a full numpad and I actually prefer the extra distance to the right for mouse usage. I've found over the years that the more I move my hands, the less likely I am to have discomfor…

God damn you cheating lefties! You cant have cake and eat it too! I really wish for keyboard options with numpad on the left. I am using numpad rarely but its handy to have when in need.

A keypadless keyboard coupled with a dedicated numberpad works great.

Re: The 40% Keyboard

#228

Post by the_gipsy »

joosters wrote: post #99
halotrope wrote: post #85

Most people would benefit much more from practicing proper (touch-) typing than upgrading/innovating devices.

Would programmers actually benefit? Realistically, how often are you limited by your typing speed when coding? I can type fast but there’s no way I could ever keep writing code at my typing speed, I’m always pausing to think about what I’m writing. If you type slower, you are still thinking about the code as you type. Is typing really the limiting factor, or is it actually the thinking?

You will never be a better programmer from faster typing.

But for my it's about reducing frustration with one of my main daily tools. Like having to look down (mostly due to my hand "getting lost", not actually looking up keys) distracts me from reading and thinking about the code on screen.

Re: The 40% Keyboard

#229

Post by leshow »

dsego wrote: post #176

Not sold on the RSI benefits. See, I bought a Planck, thinking that the ortholinear layout would make sense. But it didn't work really. Maybe I'm just accustomed to the staggered layout, but it just felt too cramped. Besides, I don't think that less movement automatically leads to less strain. In fact it felt like my fingers didn't get to stretch enough, and my wrists were too close for comfort. All in all, the mouse…

I had a preonic and felt this way too. Columnar staggered seems to be the most friendly layout, and a split board so that you hands aren't shoved together.

My setup is a split 40% keyboard with a columnar staggered layout (corne), I've got layers for a numpad and mouse emulation keys, and my window manager is i3 and firefox has the tridactyl extension. I very very rarely have to touch a mouse, for the odd times I use it the mouse emulation in QMK is usually enough. I find this is the most comfortable typing experience for me.

But yeah, basically don't discount the benefits of 40% boards because you tried an ortholinear board, I found them uncomfortable too.

Re: The 40% Keyboard

#230

Post by dsego »

pietrovismara wrote: post #179
dsego wrote: post #176

Not sold on the RSI benefits. See, I bought a Planck, thinking that the ortholinear layout would make sense. But it didn't work really. Maybe I'm just accustomed to the staggered layout, but it just felt too cramped. Besides, I don't think that less movement automatically leads to less strain. In fact it felt like my fingers didn't get to stretch enough, and my wrists were too close for comfort. All in all, the mouse…

Interesting as I always hated touchpads even after having tried several models of different quality. I'm very happy with my vertical mouse on the other hand. It only performs slightly worse than a normal mouse on very small precision movements but it's much more comfortable and still retains the speed of a mouse vs touchpad.

Have you ever tried using a macbook? That was the conversion point for me.
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