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Scapegoating free software’s failures

writing.kemitchell.com

21–30 of 123 posts

Re: Scapegoating free software’s failures

#21
All of the licenses this person defends have serious defects which are being ignored here. FSF saw and understood there were many weaknesses in gplv2 which is why they worked so hard on gplv3, which is the standard bearer for copy left in my opinion, including it's derivatives like a/l(gpl).

The main criticism that is valid is the "gunshy enforcement" by FSF, but if you listen to people like Eben Moglen they are very open about the fact that they have been working on the long game of getting into a position where enforcement would be effective instead of weaken the copyleft movement via a failed enforcement action, and that they have known it would take many years and even decades before the law side would catch up and be ready. I do think they need to step it up, but these are things that FSF et al already acknowledge and are working to address.

I have to admit a certain amount of conflicting views here, as I am at the same time sympathetic to entities afraid of doing work that others might then use and profit off of without contributing back (such as MangoDB claims), but I am also sensitive to claims that the licenses they are pursing could also be used as a cudgel to get more people towards paying them instead of using FOSS versions, and also to the fear of corps that SSPL could be a dangerous license if misconstrued. Which is why Mongo was dropped by RedHat, Fedora and Debian...

In general I think that (a/l)gplv3 did most of the work actually needed to solve these issues, and that attempts like SSPL, however laudable, are likely to fracture and weaken FOSS as a whole and, being incompatible with gpl, I cannot support them. There are ideas there that are important and should be discussed however.

I have put my actions where my mouth is on this issue. I have worked very hard to make the majority of my daily desktop and server stacks gpl or gpl compatible. (which means I steer far clear of mit/bsd licensed things if I can) The few exceptions are things I always keep an eye out for alternatives on.

An interesting SO on the SSPL: https://opensource.stackexchange.com/questions/7522/sspl-and...

In essence, I mark it as a sign of honest discussion when someone admits the weaknesses to their arguments. There is none of that here, ergo...

Re: Scapegoating free software’s failures

#22
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Two point he made that I've often wondered about. 1) why wasn't AGPL used for GPLv3? 2) why should companies be able to keep proprietary version from being distributed? The second one I can see being possible by having employees agree not to exercise their GPL redistribution rights as a condition of employment. Still it seems like a large group of companies could all agree to that kind of thing to effectively take a…

employees agree not to exercise their GPL redistribution rights If you prepare a derivative of a GPL app as a work for hire, what GPL rights would you have? You don't own the copyright on the modifications, the employer does.

I think the GPL grants rights of redistributing GPL-licensed software to "anyone with the software", not "anyone who makes a derivative work and owns it".

Re: Scapegoating free software’s failures

#23
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

employees agree not to exercise their GPL redistribution rights If you prepare a derivative of a GPL app as a work for hire, what GPL rights would you have? You don't own the copyright on the modifications, the employer does.

Hypothetically: the employer gave you a copy of the modified software (by having you modify it). He's bound by the license and so are you?

Interesting. If you were given the copy on a computer owned by your employer, is it your copy or theirs?

Re: Scapegoating free software’s failures

#24
post #5

So if I want to write an OSS library that can't be used for monetary gain, what license do I release it under? AGPLv3? EDIT: Actually, I misspoke, since monetary gain isn't the problem. I should have said "used against user freedom", but that's much less well-defined. I want a license that is as "open" as possible, for whatever definition of "open".

(IANAL, but) Yes, you'd use the AGPL because it basically maximizes user freedom. It doesn't stop people from running services for a living with the licensed code _and_ it protects the original authors and service users from exploitation.

It's just the GPL with an extra clause and that's a good thing.

Re: Scapegoating free software’s failures

#25
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

employees agree not to exercise their GPL redistribution rights If you prepare a derivative of a GPL app as a work for hire, what GPL rights would you have? You don't own the copyright on the modifications, the employer does.

Hypothetically: the employer gave you a copy of the modified software (by having you modify it). He's bound by the license and so are you?

Your employer is an entity (a person, an LLC, or a corporation), you work for that entity. The entity is allowed to distribute it among themselves but the entity prevents itself from distributing to others (by following the license constraints). You, the employee, do not gain the right to the software because the employer did not give you, personally, any permission to the software.

Only once the software has been distributed by the employer to a third party do you, the employee, get rights to that GPL software. You can replace GPL with other licenses, the premise remains the same: an employee is part of the employer and not a separate entity.

Re: Scapegoating free software’s failures

#26
They mention it in one of the lines of this blog, but apparently this individual (perhaps with the help of others, it wasn't clear) has come up with two of their own software licenses, with a website and everything.

https://guide.licensezero.com/

> The Prosperity Public License (Prosperity) works a bit like a Creative Commons NonCommercial license, but for software. Prosperity gives everyone broad permission to use your software, but limits commercial use to a short trial period of 32 days. When a commercial user’s trial runs out, they need to buy a private license or stop using your software.

> The Parity Public License (Parity) works a bit like AGPL, but requires users to release more of their own code, in more situations. Parity requires users who change, build on, or use your work to create software to release that software as open source, too. If users can’t or won’t release their work, they need to buy a private license that allows use without sharing back.

I'm one of those folks that usually defaults to AGPL for their open source work for practical reasons - it's much easier to go from a copyleft license to a permissive one due to circumstance than the other way around. However, I always found it a bit strange that there were dozens of variants of the MIT and BSD license out there, but aside from the GPL and MPL no other popular license really took up the mantle of copyleft, aside from perhaps the old Sleepycat license.

This looks like a very appealing license on its face, but the fact that it's specifically _not_ written in legalese is a little weird, though the fact that the author is a lawyer is some reassurance.

Re: Scapegoating free software’s failures

#27
Just my opinion, but the author sounds like a corporate shill (I realize he is a VC): “ The old, creaky pillars of the free software movement need convenient scapegoats, because the facts on the ground raise serious doubt about the effectiveness of their leadership and the byzantine, insular ideology of copyleft they impose.”

The state of software development and benefits to society from FSF licenses are, I believe, manifest.

I also support other open source licenses, I am not criticizing them, I am merely defending FSF licenses.

I guess that my personal bullshit meter gets tripped up when something is an attack rather than a balanced discussion.

Re: Scapegoating free software’s failures

#28

Just my opinion, but the author sounds like a corporate shill (I realize he is a VC): “ The old, creaky pillars of the free software movement need convenient scapegoats, because the facts on the ground raise serious doubt about the effectiveness of their leadership and the byzantine, insular ideology of copyleft they impose.” The state of software development and benefits to society from FSF licenses are, I believe,…

> corporate shill (I realize he is a VC):

[citation needed]

Your comment seems more to prove his point than refute it.

Re: Scapegoating free software’s failures

#29
post #28

Just my opinion, but the author sounds like a corporate shill (I realize he is a VC): “ The old, creaky pillars of the free software movement need convenient scapegoats, because the facts on the ground raise serious doubt about the effectiveness of their leadership and the byzantine, insular ideology of copyleft they impose.” The state of software development and benefits to society from FSF licenses are, I believe,…

> corporate shill (I realize he is a VC): [citation needed] Your comment seems more to prove his point than refute it.

The header said “Venture Capital Shill”, so I thought I was using a term he self identified with. Maybe I was wrong about that and it is just the title of the article.

Re: Scapegoating free software’s failures

#30
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> corporate shill (I realize he is a VC): [citation needed] Your comment seems more to prove his point than refute it.

The header said “Venture Capital Shill”, so I thought I was using a term he self identified with. Maybe I was wrong about that and it is just the title of the article.

You literally quoted part of the section that describes that the author considers that label an unfair attack made to allow people to ignore his arguments. And then used said label to attack him and ignore his arguments.

The article is worth reading more carefully, even if you don't agree with him.

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