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PayPal stops payouts to models on Pornhub

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Re: PayPal stops payouts to models on Pornhub

#301

Post by abvdasker »

miohtama wrote: post #220
mjevans wrote: post #7

A chilling effect on free speech. Real alternatives to paypal and credit cards need to enter the market. It sadly looks like my favorite hope is still not ready, but I am hopeful that this is due to slow and careful development that will lead to a stable long term outcome. https://taler.net/en/faq.html

There are alternatives. Even obvious ones like wire transfers (ACH, SEPA) which have less fraud due to enforced two-factor and better online banking cyber security. PayPal, on the other hand, is free game after you infect a Windows PC with any malware. The problem is that your CC number is both username and password. Cardsters are looking ways to convert soft credit card money to something without chargebacks. These…

This is a real opportunity for the new cohort of challenger banks like the Cash App, Chime, N26 and Monzo. You could probably win a lot of businesses and their customers by agreeing to process payments for businesses that PayPal won't. Combine that with the fact that the Venmo-like P2P payments these startups provide are fast and free and you've got another reason for merchants to switch.

Re: PayPal stops payouts to models on Pornhub

#302

Post by lonelappde »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #21
mrandish wrote: post #12

Perhaps an opportunity for Pornhub themselves to get into the payments business? I assume they have enough transactional volume and vendors to make it happen.

My hunch is that would incur unwanted liability from FOSTA-SESTA [1]. Producing content and paying talent out directly is fairly straightforward for adult entertainment. There be dragons if you're attempting to build a marketplace to do something similar. "The Stop Enabling Sex Traffickers Act (SESTA) and Allow States and Victims to Fight Online Sex Trafficking Act (FOSTA) are the U.S. Senate and House bills that as…

Pornhub already runs a marketplace. You can send money to a "verified" model through the site.

The main difference between pornhub and Backpage is that pornhub is for videos but Backpage was for live meetups (Backpage facilitated the sexual acts; pornhub only monetizes them).

Re: PayPal stops payouts to models on Pornhub

#303

Post by [deleted] »

x0x0 wrote: post #300
geomark wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the thing I find very disturbing. That an industry as highly regulated and essential to every day life as banking can pick and choose based on management's moral choices.

I doubt it's moral choices and more fraud and dispute levels, ie the cost to service a customer.

[deleted]

Re: PayPal stops payouts to models on Pornhub

#305

Post by s1artibartfast »

Nasrudith wrote: post #182
aazaa wrote: post #135

Financial deplatforming is a monster, long-term trend to watch over the next decades. Deplatforming happens with sex workers. It also happens in the US marijuana industry. It happens with perfectly legal political content. The number of ways in which someone, somewhere will be offended by products or services for sale is growing, driven by a rapidly improving worldwide communication network and delivery system, and b…

Marijuana is separate from the deplatforming in the traditional sense because federal banking laws and the DEA's stubborn Schedule 1 tautology when it clearly has medical uses are to blame as opposed to uncooerced choices.

That depends on if the bank in question is subject to the federal regulations.

Re: PayPal stops payouts to models on Pornhub

#306

Post by erichocean »

zamadatix wrote: post #131
linuxhansl wrote: post #123

Whatever you might think of the various professions... As long as it is legal, it seems the major payment service providers should not pass on their moral code onto everybody else. What's next? You get no water/power/whatever if you run a business that the service providers simply do not agree with?

Water/power are utilities and are regulated differently than other industries. But your general question is an open debate. If you run a hosting company do you have to host things you disagree with? If you run a transaction company doy you have to exchange with parties you disagree with? What if a certain type of transaction is too high risk, do they have to do it anyways? Personally I'd like to see things lean more…

The answer to all of your questions is..."Are you a platform?" [0]

If so, you must accept, by law, all customers/participants/users without prejudice or discrimination, and you may only deny or limit service to same after a written order from a court of law instructing you to do so. Furthermore, this rule supersedes any Terms of Service that a company may wish to enforce.

That's not what we have in the US today—but we should. My money is on the EU crafting legislation to that effect first. I'd normally expect California to implement this kind of legislation first, but given the amount of money donated by the big tech companies, I doubt it'll happen.

[0] A "platform" is any business with a userbase that exceeds 1% of the population (for non-commercial customers, e.g. YouTube/Twitter/Facebook), or in the case of a business-oriented marketplace (such as Amazon's Seller Central), 10% of the specific market the business is targeting with their platform.

Re: PayPal stops payouts to models on Pornhub

#307

Post by profmonocle »

na85 wrote: post #209
aazaa wrote: post #135

Financial deplatforming is a monster, long-term trend to watch over the next decades. Deplatforming happens with sex workers. It also happens in the US marijuana industry. It happens with perfectly legal political content. The number of ways in which someone, somewhere will be offended by products or services for sale is growing, driven by a rapidly improving worldwide communication network and delivery system, and b…

But Bitcoin won't solve deplatforming, because the existence of Bitcoin doesn't preclude a bank from deplatforming you. Until Bitcoin is ubiquitous (doubtful this will occur in my life time) we are still vulnerable to deplatforming when we go to exchange btc for fiat.

Being deplatformed by a bank is less of an issue because there are thousands of banks in the US. If you just need a checking account for your adult business, you're likely to find a bank that doesn't mind. Then you're on the ACH network and should be good to go as far as bitcoin goes. The only ones who could truly deplatform you off the banking system are the government, by making it illegal / highly burdensome to service you.

But the credit card industry is an oligopoly. If Visa or Mastercard don't like you, you're completely screwed as far as online payments go.

Re: PayPal stops payouts to models on Pornhub

#308

Post by juped »

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #180
toomuchtodo wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stripe won't touch adult content, I've tried (chargeback ratio is very high, I don't blame them). Very hard to find processors who will work with adult content of any sort. The real problem is that person to person money transfers shouldn't be prohibited unless by law. Perhaps Pornhub, in the US at least, could use something like Zelle to mediate transfers between patrons and performers (using their bank account to m…

US PayPal is not a bank. They don't actually perform money transfers between individuals. You pay PayPal and they disburse it to your designee. There are two transactions involved.

It's weird when people think this sort of reasoning would ever impress a regulator or judge.

Re: PayPal stops payouts to models on Pornhub

#309

Post by lonelappde »

rationalfaith wrote: post #246
jascii wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, I bite: The site you refer to is an book advert and most of its premises have been disproven in peer reviewed research.

I see pro-porn lobby is strong here. For other readers, website is backed up by reddit.com/r/nofap which has 500k+ users who are quitting or quit porn. Countless testimonies. Same website has 75+ peer reviewed research papers: https://www.yourbrainonporn.com/relevant-research-and-articl... You may be paid to lobby for porn, but it only takes truth to undo your lies.

Porn doesn't need a paid lobby for it's popularity. It has a billion avid fans. Mormon home state Utah has the most active commercial porn user base in USA.

Re: PayPal stops payouts to models on Pornhub

#310

Post by micaeked »

anoncake wrote: post #210
Alex63 wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But what do you do when the government is trying to shut down your access to banking (as in the case of gun sellers)?

The government doesn't need tricks to ban something...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Choke_Point
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